Arrowbuilders,I need advice
01-23-2003, 02:46 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: searcy arkansas USA
Posts: 64
Arrowbuilders,I need advice
I am concidering making some custom arrows for my recurve. This will be my first time and I was hoping someone could give me some advise on where to start. More specifically, what length of arrows, and tools I will need.
I am shooting about 51lbs. at about 26 to 26 1/2". My arrows will be about 27". Can I order shafts at that length with the correct stiffness for that poundage.
Any advice and tips are greatly appreciated.
Micah
I am shooting about 51lbs. at about 26 to 26 1/2". My arrows will be about 27". Can I order shafts at that length with the correct stiffness for that poundage.
Any advice and tips are greatly appreciated.
Micah
01-23-2003, 06:14 PM
#2
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Arrowbuilders,I need advice
If you're going to put broadheads on those arrows at some point, I'd suggest making them closer to 28" to keep the broadhead away from your fingers.
Spine is the tricky part. You might get by just fine with arrows spined 50-55 pounds, but depending on the performance of your bow and how smooth your release is (or isn't) you might need a different spine. I think in your case, I'd start out with 55-60 pound spine and put nocks and points on a couple of shafts to bare shaft test. If they shoot okay, then you can finish out the arrows. If they shoot stiff, then you can sand them down a little to reduce the spine until they fly right. Then do the same to the rest of the shafts before making them up. If your test shafts are too light spined, then you haven't dumped a wad of time and money in making up complete arrows and you can buy another dozen heavier spine shafts.
At the very minimum, you'll need a tape measure, pocket knife, tapering tool of some sort and a fletching jig. If you really get into it, you'll wind up buying (or making) a dip tube and cresting machine, maybe even a feather burner to make your own custom fletching shape. But I've made many, many dozens of plain-jane cedar arrows and just sprayed a couple of coats of polyurethane on 'em for a sealant. (You have to use Duco glue for poly though. Fletchtite won't stick to it.)
Straighten the shafts, measure the length you want and cut the shafts to length. Straighten again, and cut the nock and insert tapers with the tapering tools, and then apply whatever stain and/or finish you intend to use. Glue on the nocks, fletch, glue on the points and, voila! Arrows.
Just be sure to straighten all the shafts before starting each operation. By the time they're done, they'll stay straight much better than if you wait till they're made up to straighten them. Of course, you want the edge grain running 90 degrees to the bow's sight window. I go one step further.
As you look at the arrows, you see the grain runout making points along the length of the shaft. I orient the fletching so those points are facing forward ON TOP of the arrow. If an arrow breaks when it's being shot, it will generally break along the grain line. If those points are running out facing forward on the bottom of the arrow, the break will turn the back end of the arrow down, into your hand or wrist. With the points running forward on top, it's likely the back of the arrow will go UP, away from your hand or wrist.
That's something I learned from an old timer, years ago.
By the way, when you're cutting the shafts to length, remember to allow extra length for the nock and point tapers or you'll wind up with arrows shorter than you want.
Edited by - Arthur P on 01/23/2003 18:17:30
Spine is the tricky part. You might get by just fine with arrows spined 50-55 pounds, but depending on the performance of your bow and how smooth your release is (or isn't) you might need a different spine. I think in your case, I'd start out with 55-60 pound spine and put nocks and points on a couple of shafts to bare shaft test. If they shoot okay, then you can finish out the arrows. If they shoot stiff, then you can sand them down a little to reduce the spine until they fly right. Then do the same to the rest of the shafts before making them up. If your test shafts are too light spined, then you haven't dumped a wad of time and money in making up complete arrows and you can buy another dozen heavier spine shafts.
At the very minimum, you'll need a tape measure, pocket knife, tapering tool of some sort and a fletching jig. If you really get into it, you'll wind up buying (or making) a dip tube and cresting machine, maybe even a feather burner to make your own custom fletching shape. But I've made many, many dozens of plain-jane cedar arrows and just sprayed a couple of coats of polyurethane on 'em for a sealant. (You have to use Duco glue for poly though. Fletchtite won't stick to it.)
Straighten the shafts, measure the length you want and cut the shafts to length. Straighten again, and cut the nock and insert tapers with the tapering tools, and then apply whatever stain and/or finish you intend to use. Glue on the nocks, fletch, glue on the points and, voila! Arrows.
Just be sure to straighten all the shafts before starting each operation. By the time they're done, they'll stay straight much better than if you wait till they're made up to straighten them. Of course, you want the edge grain running 90 degrees to the bow's sight window. I go one step further.
As you look at the arrows, you see the grain runout making points along the length of the shaft. I orient the fletching so those points are facing forward ON TOP of the arrow. If an arrow breaks when it's being shot, it will generally break along the grain line. If those points are running out facing forward on the bottom of the arrow, the break will turn the back end of the arrow down, into your hand or wrist. With the points running forward on top, it's likely the back of the arrow will go UP, away from your hand or wrist.
That's something I learned from an old timer, years ago.
By the way, when you're cutting the shafts to length, remember to allow extra length for the nock and point tapers or you'll wind up with arrows shorter than you want.
Edited by - Arthur P on 01/23/2003 18:17:30
01-23-2003, 06:49 PM
#3
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Sault Ste Marie, MI
Posts: 451
RE: Arrowbuilders,I need advice
ArthurP, it wasnt even my question, but thanks for clearing some things up for me. I was wondering about the run-outs, and which way for them to be facing, your way makes good sense to me.
I am part way to building some arrows now. I am waiting, and waiting for my order to get here with the nocks, feathers, and points.
I am going to be the ginea pig on the spray painting the crowns. I have sprayed the crowns using instant dry lacquer paint. I will let you know if the gasket lacquer affects the paint. I dont think it will, being that they have been drying for a week now.
Now, for the question of nock and point tapers. I am using a whiffen tool. The cut is super smooth. Will I need to "rough" that up a tad before gluing?
Heck, I aint even got my cresting machine yet, it should be here any day. I will surely have more questions to follow. <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>
I am part way to building some arrows now. I am waiting, and waiting for my order to get here with the nocks, feathers, and points.
I am going to be the ginea pig on the spray painting the crowns. I have sprayed the crowns using instant dry lacquer paint. I will let you know if the gasket lacquer affects the paint. I dont think it will, being that they have been drying for a week now.
Now, for the question of nock and point tapers. I am using a whiffen tool. The cut is super smooth. Will I need to "rough" that up a tad before gluing?
Heck, I aint even got my cresting machine yet, it should be here any day. I will surely have more questions to follow. <img src=icon_smile_big.gif border=0 align=middle>
01-23-2003, 10:06 PM
#4
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Arrowbuilders,I need advice
No, Kip. They should be fine as is, and you don't want to risk messing up the tapers at all. At least you know you've got a good, sharp tool.
On the points themselves, I like to wash them out with acetone to get the preservative oil out of 'em and wrap a piece of 80 grit sandpaper on a tapered shaft and rough the inside up some, then rinse 'em out again. Sure helps the hotmelt glue hang onto them a lot better.
I've spray painted crowns before and finished them off with poly, but never have dipped any painted shafts in gasket laquer. I'm waiting to hear your report.
On the points themselves, I like to wash them out with acetone to get the preservative oil out of 'em and wrap a piece of 80 grit sandpaper on a tapered shaft and rough the inside up some, then rinse 'em out again. Sure helps the hotmelt glue hang onto them a lot better.
I've spray painted crowns before and finished them off with poly, but never have dipped any painted shafts in gasket laquer. I'm waiting to hear your report.
01-23-2003, 11:22 PM
#5
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: searcy arkansas USA
Posts: 64
RE: Arrowbuilders,I need advice
ArthurP, Thanks for all your advice. I'm sure it will be helpfull. Maybe you could help on one more thing. You mentioned straighting the shafts. Ive heard ofpeople having to work thier shafts to become striaght but have never done it myself. How do I go about this? All I know about is graphite and aluminum. I spin them on my finger and if they wobble I chunk the into my armadillo pile.
Also, I've been dipping and cresting for about 2 yrs. now, but only with alum. and graph. Do I stain first, then dip? I can't wait to try my first cedar shafts!
Also, this may be an elementary question, but it is one I havn't really had a problem with on my aluminum arrows. How, will I be able to tell if the spine is correct when I'm shooting. I know it has to do with the kick of the arrow to one side or the other but I'm not sure which side is which.(I'm a right handed shooter)
Thanks for all your advice. Micah
Also, I've been dipping and cresting for about 2 yrs. now, but only with alum. and graph. Do I stain first, then dip? I can't wait to try my first cedar shafts!
Also, this may be an elementary question, but it is one I havn't really had a problem with on my aluminum arrows. How, will I be able to tell if the spine is correct when I'm shooting. I know it has to do with the kick of the arrow to one side or the other but I'm not sure which side is which.(I'm a right handed shooter)
Thanks for all your advice. Micah
01-24-2003, 07:47 AM
#6
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Arrowbuilders,I need advice
To straighten wood shafts, just eyeball down the shaft from each end and see if it's straight. If it's not, just hold the crooked area, or areas, over the heel of your hand and bend it the other way to straighten it. You can do it pretty quick when you've had some practice. I've hardly ever had any cedars that I couldn't straighten by hand. But I have had to use heat on rare occassions.
If you don't trust your eye, you can roll the shafts on a flat surface and check them that way. Don't expect wood shafts to be perfectly straight like a good aluminum shaft. Keep in mind that you're dealing with a natural material. It's nice to achieve perfect straightness, but not necessary. But of course, you do want your broadheads on your bestest, straightest arrows. <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>
Yes, you apply whatever stain you want and let it dry throroughly before dipping. I like alcohol or water based stains instead of oil stains for arrows.
Bare shafting for a right hand shooter, an overspine arrow will plane off to the left and stick into the target nock right, underspine will plane to the right and stick into the target nock left. The correct spine will fly straight and group right in with your fletched arrows.
If you don't trust your eye, you can roll the shafts on a flat surface and check them that way. Don't expect wood shafts to be perfectly straight like a good aluminum shaft. Keep in mind that you're dealing with a natural material. It's nice to achieve perfect straightness, but not necessary. But of course, you do want your broadheads on your bestest, straightest arrows. <img src=icon_smile_wink.gif border=0 align=middle>
Yes, you apply whatever stain you want and let it dry throroughly before dipping. I like alcohol or water based stains instead of oil stains for arrows.
Bare shafting for a right hand shooter, an overspine arrow will plane off to the left and stick into the target nock right, underspine will plane to the right and stick into the target nock left. The correct spine will fly straight and group right in with your fletched arrows.
