Bowtech not what I was hoping !
03-03-2002, 08:12 PM
#21
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Cincinnati oh USA
Posts: 626
RE: Bowtech not what I was hoping !
stodr, often on this forum people get so caught up on the brand of bow they shoot they often become overbearing about what they shoot & everything isn't up to par. A lot of variables can come into factor other than just the bow, yes maybe it had a problem, maybe the chrono was off, maybe it had the wrong string, maybe that bow was just a bad one.....we don't know for sure. lets just respect his opinion on the bow & wish him luck. if there was a probolem with the bow then the dealer shoud have known this & corrected it once he shot it. I have been involved with archery for a heck of a long time & used to sell the stuff. If I had a bad bow in my shop & someone shot it I knew it & I fixed it or had the company fix it but I would never try to keep selling that bow to the customer. I also always checked the bows when they came to make sure soething wasn't wrong before it went up on the racks.
03-04-2002, 06:10 AM
#22
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Baltimore Maryland USA
Posts: 1,385
RE: Bowtech not what I was hoping !
We all know what happens when we make assumptions. This one is an example: "If I had a bad bow in my shop & someone shot it I knew it & I fixed it or had the company fix it but I would never try to keep selling that bow to the customer. I also always checked the bows when they came to make sure soething wasn't wrong before it went up on the racks."
This particular bow had just recently been set up. I was in the process of tuning Dublelung's Mathews Safari and, he being a good customer, I offered to let him shoot the bow. We have literally hundreds of bows on the racks and more in storage. For us to "check" every bow by shooting it before is hits the racks is not SOP. Besides, this particular manufacturer claims to have shot every bow before it leaves the factory; therefore, why was it let out of the factory if it was faulty?
Next, I was NOT trying to sell Dublelung a bow. Everyone was talking about it, and he being a follower of the forums, I thought it would he would like to know how the bow shot. I also wanted to have a second unbiased opinion about this particular bow.
Then there are the comments "It might not have anything to do with your setup but it is quarenteed to shoot the speed on the spec sheet and if it is not then you can send it back. It sounds to me like like the cam is rolled into the wronge position. The bows that I have tried of theirs and the ones I shoot if you get that cam out of time it is alot slower , don't know about the shock though."
As I have said in the past, there are only a few manufacturers whose bows do the speeds that are advertised. Either the others are over-rated or these few are way under-rated. This gets into the "standards" that I had discussed in previous discussions. If I were to send every bow back that didn't live up to the advertised speed, I could only keep a few bows on the racks. When you get into a speed guarantee situation, it is my test methods verses the manufacturers' test methods. My problem is that I can't show the customers those advertised speeds unless I "fudge" specifications such as draw length. Now keep in mind that I used the term "manufacturers'" which is plural.
Then there is the comment "It sounds to me like like the cam is rolled into the wronge position." My first comment that I made on this thread was "The bow was definitely in time. I had just gone through and timed all the bows on the rack according to the factory timing marks."
I beg you to please read what I have posted.
As I said Saturday evening, "I think I will disassemble this bow and check to make sure there isn't a cracked limb and put it on the Apple to check for a weak limb. After thinking about it, these are things that could cause this dilemma.
I'll report back to let you know what I find."
I haven't been to the shop since I posted that statement because of personal problems. I will check this out as best I can and report my findings.
This particular bow had just recently been set up. I was in the process of tuning Dublelung's Mathews Safari and, he being a good customer, I offered to let him shoot the bow. We have literally hundreds of bows on the racks and more in storage. For us to "check" every bow by shooting it before is hits the racks is not SOP. Besides, this particular manufacturer claims to have shot every bow before it leaves the factory; therefore, why was it let out of the factory if it was faulty?
Next, I was NOT trying to sell Dublelung a bow. Everyone was talking about it, and he being a follower of the forums, I thought it would he would like to know how the bow shot. I also wanted to have a second unbiased opinion about this particular bow.
Then there are the comments "It might not have anything to do with your setup but it is quarenteed to shoot the speed on the spec sheet and if it is not then you can send it back. It sounds to me like like the cam is rolled into the wronge position. The bows that I have tried of theirs and the ones I shoot if you get that cam out of time it is alot slower , don't know about the shock though."
As I have said in the past, there are only a few manufacturers whose bows do the speeds that are advertised. Either the others are over-rated or these few are way under-rated. This gets into the "standards" that I had discussed in previous discussions. If I were to send every bow back that didn't live up to the advertised speed, I could only keep a few bows on the racks. When you get into a speed guarantee situation, it is my test methods verses the manufacturers' test methods. My problem is that I can't show the customers those advertised speeds unless I "fudge" specifications such as draw length. Now keep in mind that I used the term "manufacturers'" which is plural.
Then there is the comment "It sounds to me like like the cam is rolled into the wronge position." My first comment that I made on this thread was "The bow was definitely in time. I had just gone through and timed all the bows on the rack according to the factory timing marks."
I beg you to please read what I have posted.
As I said Saturday evening, "I think I will disassemble this bow and check to make sure there isn't a cracked limb and put it on the Apple to check for a weak limb. After thinking about it, these are things that could cause this dilemma.
I'll report back to let you know what I find."
I haven't been to the shop since I posted that statement because of personal problems. I will check this out as best I can and report my findings.
03-04-2002, 12:55 PM
#24
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Lavaca Arkansas
Posts: 25
RE: Bowtech not what I was hoping !
I was just curious. How long does bowtech guarantee the bow to shoot the advertised speed. On initial purchase, or for the life of the bow since it has a lifetime guarantee. I don't know if this has ever been asked before. Just wondering?
Thanks, <img src=icon_smile_clown.gif border=0 align=middle> <img src=icon_smile_clown.gif border=0 align=middle>
RoyD
Thanks, <img src=icon_smile_clown.gif border=0 align=middle> <img src=icon_smile_clown.gif border=0 align=middle>
RoyD
03-04-2002, 05:14 PM
#25
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Baltimore Maryland USA
Posts: 1,385
RE: Bowtech not what I was hoping !
I spent several hours this morning checking the limbs, settings, speed and changing the cable slide around on several models. I documented a lot of data so that I left "no stone unturned".
Since I said I would report back to you, here it is. There is nothing apparently wrong with the bow. What Dublelung felt in hand shock was his analysis based on bows that he has been shooting for years - Mathews. Admittedly, a lot of the Mathews bows are known for very little hand shock. Shooting anything else, when you're used to one of the best in that category, leaves you with a negative attitude towards other products. His expletive may have been a little harsh for some. Then again, what do they make LimbSaver products for?
I did change the cable slide configuration around several times and did not see any significant differences. There may have been as much as 1/2 fps difference in speed by the change.
What was said, was said by one of my customers from tests we conducted at my store. He has every right to his opinion about any product based on a comparative study. I have a professional responsibility to my suppliers to promote their products and to my customers to do comparative analyses.
I will be critical on technology and test methods. I will not, however, pick out a manufacturer, any manufacturer, and bring them before a public forum unless I see public safety as an issue.
I studied my response all day long and this is what I feel is a professional reply.
Since I said I would report back to you, here it is. There is nothing apparently wrong with the bow. What Dublelung felt in hand shock was his analysis based on bows that he has been shooting for years - Mathews. Admittedly, a lot of the Mathews bows are known for very little hand shock. Shooting anything else, when you're used to one of the best in that category, leaves you with a negative attitude towards other products. His expletive may have been a little harsh for some. Then again, what do they make LimbSaver products for?
I did change the cable slide configuration around several times and did not see any significant differences. There may have been as much as 1/2 fps difference in speed by the change.
What was said, was said by one of my customers from tests we conducted at my store. He has every right to his opinion about any product based on a comparative study. I have a professional responsibility to my suppliers to promote their products and to my customers to do comparative analyses.
I will be critical on technology and test methods. I will not, however, pick out a manufacturer, any manufacturer, and bring them before a public forum unless I see public safety as an issue.
I studied my response all day long and this is what I feel is a professional reply.
03-04-2002, 08:00 PM
#26
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Cincinnati oh USA
Posts: 626
RE: Bowtech not what I was hoping !
Len I think your response is more than professional. to me it sounds like nothing is wrong with the bow but the shooter was compairing it to a bow that for the most part has less hand shock than the bowtech. heck it's just the guys opinion & nothing against bowtech at all, he just didn't like the bow.....lets leave it like that. Some people like bowtech, some PSE, heck even a few like hoyt or mathews. if one bow was the perfect bow for everyone we would all be shooting it & no other companies would be around.
03-04-2002, 11:36 PM
#28
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Tennessee USA
Posts: 17
RE: Bowtech not what I was hoping !
Baskin-Robbins has 31 flavors... Why? Because people have different tastes and opinions. If we all liked the same bow, who would we be able to laugh at? Mine is better because it is green and yours is black? How much fun would that be?
Ugly Hoyts, Overhyped Overpriced Mathews, Loud Cheap Looking PSEs, Old Rattling Bowtechs, Harsh Shooting High Country, Mathews Look Alike Parker, Same Old Limb Proline, What the Heck is that Oneida, did I leave anybody out? If I did, those bows must not even be worth mentioning.
Now aint that fun?
Len, fine job on your reply and thanks.
Ugly Hoyts, Overhyped Overpriced Mathews, Loud Cheap Looking PSEs, Old Rattling Bowtechs, Harsh Shooting High Country, Mathews Look Alike Parker, Same Old Limb Proline, What the Heck is that Oneida, did I leave anybody out? If I did, those bows must not even be worth mentioning.
Now aint that fun?
Len, fine job on your reply and thanks.
03-05-2002, 08:43 AM
#30
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Phoenixville, PA USA
Posts: 5,541
RE: Bowtech not what I was hoping !
Len, thanks for the follow up post. I have been watching this thread for a while now and I think you have summed it up best. Dublelung made a comparitive analysis and posted his findings. You checked the bow (which is more than some would have done, kudos to you) and it is in proper working order. Dublelung didn't like it, no big deal.