Great article on Broadhead sharpness
07-09-2004, 07:44 AM
#11
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 2,994
RE: Great article on Broadhead sharpness
I admit I was left scratching my head and muttering expletives on the center heart/lung shots...
I think a big part of how the deer reacts is based on it's state of mind pre-shot, and whether or not you hit ANY bone.
I shot a doe with a 1" cd scary sharp Steelforce 4 blade 2 years ago. She had wondered by my stand looking like she hadn't a care in the world, certainly didn't have a clue I was around. She bounded away a bit, then stopped to look around like "what the ____ was that" and fell over dead. When dressed and skinned, I had missed ribs going in and out, nothing but both lungs. She must not've read the article.
The doe I shot last year with a 1.5" cd standard sharp Rocket meteorite ran like a bat out of hell for 50 yards straight out into a picked corn field before dropping on the run and doing a sommersault. She had been nervous just before the shot and knew something wasn't right (questionable stand placement by my brother-in-law, bless his heart). When dressed and skinned, I had missed ribs going in, but center punched one coming out. I also got heart and both lungs, which is another thing. In my anecdotal experience, deer shot in the heart run as long as possible, possibly because it's harder to miss ribs when doing so, which is why I prefer to only hit lungs if at all possible.
I think bone hit and attitude come into play a bunch. Plus, the author was using 2 blade heads, which exponentially increase your odds of slipping between the ribs.
I think a big part of how the deer reacts is based on it's state of mind pre-shot, and whether or not you hit ANY bone.
I shot a doe with a 1" cd scary sharp Steelforce 4 blade 2 years ago. She had wondered by my stand looking like she hadn't a care in the world, certainly didn't have a clue I was around. She bounded away a bit, then stopped to look around like "what the ____ was that" and fell over dead. When dressed and skinned, I had missed ribs going in and out, nothing but both lungs. She must not've read the article.
The doe I shot last year with a 1.5" cd standard sharp Rocket meteorite ran like a bat out of hell for 50 yards straight out into a picked corn field before dropping on the run and doing a sommersault. She had been nervous just before the shot and knew something wasn't right (questionable stand placement by my brother-in-law, bless his heart). When dressed and skinned, I had missed ribs going in, but center punched one coming out. I also got heart and both lungs, which is another thing. In my anecdotal experience, deer shot in the heart run as long as possible, possibly because it's harder to miss ribs when doing so, which is why I prefer to only hit lungs if at all possible.
I think bone hit and attitude come into play a bunch. Plus, the author was using 2 blade heads, which exponentially increase your odds of slipping between the ribs.
07-09-2004, 08:36 AM
#12
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: East Yapank NY USA
Posts: 3,457
RE: Great article on Broadhead sharpness
I have read that thing a few times...then looked at the top of the page to see it was a BUCKMASTER article..........LOL[:-][
]
The same outfit that tried to sell me a vacume cleaner............now pushing bh sharpeners
YES sharp broadheads are important........but at what point is it overkill.....and has no effect on bh performance.
30 yrd average??? Unless he has many spine shots thrown in there I don’t buy it. Or is he so lucky that his 2 blade bh always misses ribs and they walk off for 30 yds. If they are walking is it his super sharp heads or the fact that he shoots 2 blades???
A deer running will cover 30 yds in about 4 seconds……….they don’t die that quick on average.
I call bull on the double lung, and center punched heart survivors……I call bull on the 30 yd average drop.
That’s 3 easy bulls in one article….IMO….he has an agenda…he is selling something.
Most double lung / heart shot deer die in about 20 seconds or less. That’s about 100yds or less travel time. Coagulation is not a major factor in this time frame – there just is not enough time for the cells to respond and release the proteins needed to start coagulation.
I also feel there is a ceiling effect when it comes to bh sharpness. There is a point where it just doesn’t make a difference.
Yes Rockets are the some of the least sharp blades on the market…..but IMO they will kill a deer just as dead and in the same time frame as the same head super sharpened.
Dull is bad….Sharp is good. But super sharp is not needed to the extent this guy states.
]The same outfit that tried to sell me a vacume cleaner............now pushing bh sharpeners
YES sharp broadheads are important........but at what point is it overkill.....and has no effect on bh performance.
. I have been keeping records of how far my bow-shot game traveled after the shot. In the last 10 years the average has been about 30 yards
A deer running will cover 30 yds in about 4 seconds……….they don’t die that quick on average.
I call bull on the double lung, and center punched heart survivors……I call bull on the 30 yd average drop.
That’s 3 easy bulls in one article….IMO….he has an agenda…he is selling something.
Most double lung / heart shot deer die in about 20 seconds or less. That’s about 100yds or less travel time. Coagulation is not a major factor in this time frame – there just is not enough time for the cells to respond and release the proteins needed to start coagulation.
I also feel there is a ceiling effect when it comes to bh sharpness. There is a point where it just doesn’t make a difference.
Yes Rockets are the some of the least sharp blades on the market…..but IMO they will kill a deer just as dead and in the same time frame as the same head super sharpened.
Dull is bad….Sharp is good. But super sharp is not needed to the extent this guy states.
07-09-2004, 08:52 AM
#14
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: East Yapank NY USA
Posts: 3,457
RE: Great article on Broadhead sharpness
What are you doing, trying to single handedly ruin the economy or something?
I just don't like the way its turning...........I don't like the gimickery I see......the lies.....the propaganda.....
I am all for advances and technology in this sport...........but not when one has to "invent" the problem before he "invents" the solution.
Whats worse is that the "industry" insults you and me every time theymake their "claim", then sit back and wait for us to run............
The amount of crap thats being sold for bowhunting is astonishing.
Its a Simple sport, against a simple animal. Technology can't change that.
07-09-2004, 09:43 AM
#15
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Bremen, GA.
Posts: 2,091
RE: Great article on Broadhead sharpness
I agree with rack! 90% of whats in magazines and on TV outdoor shows is just gimicks on what you really don`t need![:'(] every thing is commercialize these days. If a dollar can be made? Someone will try to make it! by creating some crapy gimick that attracks hunters in beleaving that if you by my product your going to be a very succesfull![:'(] We have all bought into these type gimmicks from time to time to find out most of this type crap we never needed to begin with. I fell for a lot of the old stuff back in the early 80`s but it does`t compair to today! Open any hunting mag, or watch any hunting TV show most is advertising on the latest and greatest gimicks.
07-09-2004, 11:29 AM
#16
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Chatsworth Georgia USA
Posts: 79
RE: Great article on Broadhead sharpness
First off, I still consider myself a newbie to archery. But
"The heart-shot doe was shot later by a rifle hunter, also two years after an arrow passed through the CENTER of her heart. She too was healthy and fat, showing no evidence of ills due to the 6-inch section of aluminum shaft still in the center of her heart."
Dang, she's walking around with an aluminum shaft in her heart. (Where is the BH at this time??) Everytime her heart beats she still has the shaft in her heart.
Sounds to me like some one is trying to put the shaft in my pocketbook, lol.
Yes, it is VERY IMPORTANT to have a very sharp bh. But how the heck did the Indians every kill anything with their fixed bh's??
As always some good points though.
"The heart-shot doe was shot later by a rifle hunter, also two years after an arrow passed through the CENTER of her heart. She too was healthy and fat, showing no evidence of ills due to the 6-inch section of aluminum shaft still in the center of her heart."
Dang, she's walking around with an aluminum shaft in her heart. (Where is the BH at this time??) Everytime her heart beats she still has the shaft in her heart.
Sounds to me like some one is trying to put the shaft in my pocketbook, lol.
Yes, it is VERY IMPORTANT to have a very sharp bh. But how the heck did the Indians every kill anything with their fixed bh's??
As always some good points though.
07-09-2004, 11:42 AM
#17
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Baltimore MD USA
Posts: 96
RE: Great article on Broadhead sharpness
He makes some good points, but those two examples of recovered deer require a person to make some pretty major assumptions. He has no way of knowing if the broadheads recovered from those deer were sharp or not when they hit the deer. It's ridiculous to assume that they were dull. It would be just as accurate to assume that the people who shot those deer were left handed, and that those recovered deer were proof that left-handed people shouldn't hunt.
And please, an animal shot through the center of it's heart is not going to survive. I don't care if the broadhead was dull as a brick.
My BS detector is pegged.
And please, an animal shot through the center of it's heart is not going to survive. I don't care if the broadhead was dull as a brick.
My BS detector is pegged.
07-09-2004, 11:43 AM
#18
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Heaven IA USA
Posts: 2,597
RE: Great article on Broadhead sharpness
I just don't like the way its turning...........I don't like the gimickery I see......the lies.....the propaganda.....
I am all for advances and technology in this sport...........but not when one has to "invent" the problem before he "invents" the solution.
Whats worse is that the "industry" insults you and me every time theymake their "claim", then sit back and wait for us to run............
The amount of crap thats being sold for bowhunting is astonishing.
Its a Simple sport, against a simple animal. Technology can't change that.
I am all for advances and technology in this sport...........but not when one has to "invent" the problem before he "invents" the solution.
Whats worse is that the "industry" insults you and me every time theymake their "claim", then sit back and wait for us to run............
The amount of crap thats being sold for bowhunting is astonishing.
Its a Simple sport, against a simple animal. Technology can't change that.
I was listening to a conversation one time between two bowhunters. They were discussing broadheads when the one guy mentioned a particular brand of broadhead. The other gentleman emphasised that those particular broadheads were not very sharp. The first guy turned and looked him in the eye and said "your talking to a guy that has killed deer with a flint on the end of his arrow, those broadheads are plenty sharp!"
For me that put a whole new perspective on the subject. Perhaps everybody has their own definition of what sharp is. After being banged around in a quiver for a few days or weeks and exposed to the elements even the blades that were shaving sharp lose that edge with no other contact. They may cut hair but not shave hair. If shaving hair is the definition of a sharp head, I would be willing to bet that more deer are killed with "dull" heads than there are with sharp ones.
It is alarming to see the power of the dollar in our sport (I don't even like to use that term "sport". It is more like a way of life for so many of us.).
Quality products are one thing, but when a person compromises their beliefs to the highest bidder to make a buck off of inferior product it is frightening.
