Arthur P

Well, if that's the case then I'm nimrod #2. I shot 80 pound energy wheels for my field archery bow. 90-100 pound hard cam for pre-IBO 'animal shoots.' I hunted with longbows up to 120 pounds. And that's exactly why I can't pull those blasted hard cam bows today at ANY poundage. My 60 pound energy wheel bow and 50-55 pound stickbows is about all I can handle without pain in my shoulders.

Accuracy and forgiveness... Field archery is a game of accuracy and consistency. It is also a game of stamina. People use equipment that helps them put up a high score. If accuracy and forgiveness between soft and hard cams are equal; if the low poundage hard cam is no different to shoot than a higher poundage soft cam; then you'd see just as many of those hard cams on the shooting stakes in field archery tournaments as energy wheels or soft cams. Where are they?

The draw cycle on the hard cam bows is probably why so many people like 80% letoff so they can draw well before the shot and hold it until the shot is presented. Because of poor equipment selection, many of those nimrods simply CAN'T draw and shoot when the shot is presented without getting busted by the animal. They're overbowed and overcammed. I've seen some real contortion artists trying to break over those beastly hard cams - bow arm jacked up to the moon, teeth clenched and grinding, huffing and puffing like a freight train, turning red in the face, veins in their neck and forehead swelling to epic proportions, straining to the point of popping a hernia, hemmorhoids hanging down to their socks...

For a hunting bow, it's much better to have a smooth drawing cam that you can easily draw straight back - especially under adverse weather conditions when you're cold and tired - with minimal movement than to have a hard pulling cam that forces you to go through those kinds of gyrations.

Personally, I've pulled hard cam 60 pound bows that were worse than 70 pound soft cam bows. Wrecked shoulders are VERY good at telling the difference.

To answer the question about where the maintenance cost difference is: I've had much worse problems with creep, noise and vibration with hard cam bows. Which cause - More frequent tuning. More frequent string/cable changes. Having to buy extra silencing products. Having to use stuff like loktite to keep screws from backing out. Soft cams are much less intensive. Round energy wheels like I use on my compound, while not quite 'set it and forget it', there is very little maintenance involved.

pdq 5oh

If the cam and idler are larger in diameter than the hard cam, you'll gain some brace height. Also, I'd think due to the draw force curve being more rounded or flat, the resulting recoil would be lessened. The harder cam is going to accelerate the arrow faster, initially. The result will be more recoil. But I don't think there will be significantly more vibration.

Pinwheel 12

Guys-

We are talking up two different animals, of course, but not to the extent that some would have others beleive. A hard cammed bow will of course offer a steeper draw force curve, no arguement. Thus the rounder radius cam will in fact be "smoother", no question. BUT--- if both are drawn within the "individual comfort range" of the archer for each draw force curve, there is no problem. Accuracy is equal with both systems IF the person behind the bow can shoot both bows effectively-- out of a machine there is no difference, both will shoot arrow after arrow into the same hole when tuned correctly--- as stated in my last post it is all in the nock travel of each individual eccentric configuration if both bows are otherwise the same except for eccentrics--- and to touch on Arts' point about field rounds and cammed bows, I do believe there are alot of Martin Scepter 2's and 3's, Merlin Max 2000's and 3000's with Rapid and Rapid 2 cams, and Bowman Accurisers with Wedel cams out there, not to mention the older Hoyt Command cammed bows, etc etc, shooting field rounds. (And winning to boot.)

I also like a smooth bow, and that is why I now shoot the Omega Hybrid for all applications. The most forgiving system I have shot to date, and I've shot alot of 'em! (sorry, had to get my plug in there.)

Art, you were a brute, huh? I only shot 100lbers a few times---even back then I knew when too much was too much. (or so I thought! LOL) I now pull between 55-62 lbs depending upon application. If one cannot comfortably draw a 70lb or 60lb or even a 50lb bow, then don't try! Draw what is "comfortable". THAT is the biggest thing that people overlook....if you are not totally comfortable, you aren't going to hit as well as you would if you were. If worried about your "manhood", just tell everyone you are drawing 70lbs but don't let them draw your bow. Problem solved. Pinwheel 12

JOE PA

The feel at full draw would be one of the things that would be different, and perhaps better, depending on your preference. I just switched from a hard cam bow that peaked very late in the draw cycle, and had virtually no valley to speak of. The "new" bow peaks earlier, and has somewhat reduced draw force later in the draw, plus a valley with some width to it. For me, I am better able to relax at full draw with the milder cam. I guess if you are shootiing correctly with back tension (I am currently working on improving this), then it really doesn't matter too much. I also don't know about the accuracy part of it. The "classic" answer was always that round wheel bows were more accurate than hard cams. I personally have not found that to be true for me, but I have much less experience with this than a lot of other guys here.[:'(]

Arthur P

deleted duplicate post computer foul up[:'(]

Arthur P

Pinwheel, I wouldn't say I was a brute. At 6'6" and 300+ pounds, I ARE a brute. Even though, back then I looked more like an NFL tight end instead of an interior lineman.

You know, I pulled out some of Mullaney's bow reports and looked at force draw curves on several bows. In each case, with each drop in draw weight, the front and back slopes of the curve are shallower and the peaks are rounder. So, in effect, lowering the draw weight had the effect of softening the cam. Perhaps I need to retract some of my earlier comments.

This could be another example of how my draw length gives me experiences that people with 'normal' draw lengths do not have to contend with.

Pinwheel 12

Art-

Wow, yep you ARE a brute! 6'0" and 230 would look pretty small against ya for sure......LOL. (gotta have quarterbacks, too!)

Yes, The force curves will differ with variances in weight, but like I said we of course are still talking hard cam and soft cam or wheel, so there will be differences regardless---but only subtle differences if one is within a "comfortable range" with each. Good shooting, Pinwheel 12

Cougar Mag

Reminds me of guys drawing their bows at the range, heck I thought they were trying to shoot at airplanes.

pdq 5oh

Cougar, I hear you. It's pretty un-nerving when some yo-yo head shoots out a light in the ceiling.[]