Raymond van Halm

As for your topic I want to mention what i did in another topic.
Go see what i wrote in: Mathing Arrow Spine

Good luck.

JOE PA

For some reason, my other post did not show up. I went to edit it, and most of what I typed was there. Then clicked OK, and it came up blank anyway![:@]

ACCs should be OK with a prong rest with either straight offset, or mild helical. If you want to use hard helical and a prong rest, I would use feathers.

I personally tried out a Whisker Biscuit rest, and have been pleased with the accuracy and arrow security. It will be my hunting rest until I find something better.

I have had a bad experience with Blackhawk Vapor ACAs myself. I only got a half dozen, but 2 of them would not shoot with the group even with field points at 30 yds. The others seemed to break down and lose accuracy faster than other carbons I have tried. I even ruined one of them just trying to take fletching off to refletch. A sliver of carbon lifted up, and peeled all the way back to the back of the shaft. Didn' t trust it after that. I have refletched a few carbons over the years, and that is the only time something like that has happened.

I can get my ACCs for a reasonable price. Otherwise, I would probably shoot Beman ICS Hunters, or Easton Aluminums. JMHO

arkansasbowhunter

So I am still confused a little bit. are ya' ll saying the ics hunters are as good as the a/c/c' s? are the a/c/c' s worth the extra mola or do I need to suck it up and continue to buy new ICS hunters. Also, are there any extra tips for selecting shafts in the store? I have just been randomly picking 6 at a time and take them home and fletch them up. another question does it matter in consistency where you place your cock feather. thanks for the info.

IMN23D

arkansas.....as far as placing my cock feather, I do the "bearing test". Simply take 3 bearings (old skateboard bearings work good), put one on each end and one in the middle of your arrow. Support the two end bearings across an inside corner of a counter top. Push down on the center bearing. The arrow will spin in the bearings to the weak spine of the arrow. I usually do it a couple of times to make sure (some of the carbons have 2 spots, I go with the stronger one). I then mark the top of the arrow, and put my cock feather there. I shoot a Bodoodle so my cock feather is down. Since doing this I have never had to "index" my nocks. If one of my arrows won't group after this, it only gets worse by twisting the nock. I heard this works with finger shooters too but don't know any (the cock would have to be on the side).

Raymond van Halm

Thats intresting...
I never took notice on where to place the cockfeather.
I didnt know it would make a difference with the matrix wrapped carbons....

Jerry/Pa

23D, I thought I was the only nut who did that. LMAO. I do that by floating them in water. Submerge and spin them in water and they come to the top with the crown down. Talk about compulsive obcessive. My wife just rolls hers eyes any more. Thats great. JERRY

JeffB

To answer your first question: Absolutely not. Among ALL carbon shafts they are some of the most consistent for spine and weight...I generally have to trim from either end to get straightness "decent" and that doesn't always help..even at my rather short 27.75 to 28" arrow length. IME, A/C/Cs are worth every penny, but in the all carbons the Easton C2 shafts and Beman ICSH/camo ICSH are decent hunting shafts if care is taken with them from the get-go.

My tips for buying/using all-carbon arrows would be

1) buy raw shafts only and in dozens only. Don't mix and match from different dozens (cause they may mix, but they don't always match)

2) Use an arrow roller (i.e.Apple arrow roller found in most archery catalogs) or straightener to figure out how each shaft needs to be cut for best straightness (cut from one end or both..or use the arrow for a tomato stake)

3) If possible (i.e not too much trouble) beforehand, like IMN23D does, find the high spine side

4) trash the push in nocks and install a uni-bushing and G-nock (w/ epoxy) for greater longevity and safety.

5) Fletch cock feather appropriately according to what you find in step 3, then complete fletching

6) use slow setting epoxy for inserts w/ the broadheads you plan to shoot, turning them until you get concentricity as good as possible

I usually ignore # 5 due to a wife who nags me to no end when "I play with my shafts in the bathtub" and just rotate the nocks If I get a "flyer".

Or you can buy A/C/Cs and ignore #'s 2, possibly #3, #4 and possibly #5. I very rarely have to turn a nock on A/C/C to get them to group tight (at least within my abilities)

arkansasbowhunter

to jerry, when you sping them in water is the spine up or down? am confused on term crown. do I place my cock feather on the upside or down side. I don't have any bearings to test the arrow with unfortunately.

to jeff b. thanks for the info. but, when I goto my local archery shop all the arrows are in a big bin and not grouped from by the dozen. is this how they are at you shop? how then do I not mix and match them per say? are they sold to the retail shops from the manufacturer by the dozen? whooshh lots more questions as I learn about this subject. its kinda like building a fly rod and having to learn about the spine except arrows are a lot smaller and you cant flex the sections like you a fly rod.

IMN23D

I found that the "float test" didn't match the "bearing test" for spine. Sometimes they matched, most times they didn't. When "float testing" I would still have to index my nocks, with the "bearing test" I never have had to yet.

PatapscoMike

If the floating-high side matches the spine, it is purely by coincidence. Floating the arrow just shows where the natural curve is. The spine is a function of the graphite layers themselves, and is just as likely to be perpendicular to this high side than along it.

When the arrow flexes, it will flex toward the point of weakest spine, not to the spot that floats the highest. In my opinion, based on years of studying how things flex for my business, I think the floating concept has absolutely nothing to do with how an arrow will shoot. You need to check for the spine by flexing the shaft. This is the only way to see how the arrow is going to flex when placed under load.