Pinwheel 12

And here I thought you were going to take the " bait" , Frank![&:]


But you and Straightarrow are seeing it correctly for the most part, the only additional comment I have is that if a person has poor form and shooting style, that is what he has, no matter the rest style, and this needs to be correctly addressed as quickly as possible as the the real problem/issue this person has. Covering-up the problem with a rest of any other equipment to me doesn' t cure the problem, as the archer can further develop this form issue as time goes on and thus eventually become even less accurate and it will not matter WHAT he has for equipment, it will not help him. Going directly to the TRUE source of the individual problem at hand is IMHO the only correct way to address such issues, everything else is a temporary fix that could quickly evaporate. Good shooting, Pinwheel 12

WV Hunter

I' ll agree that they are a " fad" to some degree, for sure. IMO dropaways will not improve your shooting as a rule, however...depending on the particular setup....it may quite a bit(especially for anyone that doesn' t know how to tune a bow). If you can tune your bow with a conventional style rest, and are happy and confident with it...you are good to go. Many folks however, have problems with arrow clearance, and this is where a drop away can help(if setup properly). Personally I switched from a TM style rest to a MZE, and I' m very happy with it' s performance. I primarily use it for hunting, and I believe it offers some very good advantages for a hunting bow,and that is why I switched. I didn' t notice any more or less accuracy between the two.

diyj98....with this rest, you don' t need to worry about the arrow at all...drawing or letting down, and it can' t fall off the rest...period. To me that is a huge advantage over many conventional rests, as far as hunting goes. I can concentrate on the animal, not whether or not my arrow is ok.
Like was said, dropaways are not a magic bandaid, but they can and are very effective.

Pinwheel...I agree with what you are saying for the most part, and obviously you know more than I. Just curious, as a professional with loads of experience, what is your take on the MZE?

PABowhntr

Fishing season starts on the 12th here Kevin, so it is a little early for that.

But I think we share the same view on this one for a change.

buckskin73

Have any of you had tuning problems with drop away rests? I could not seem to " microtune" my bow. I use this term from the Easton tuning guide. With a drop away rest, fine adjustments to rest and nock position did not significantly change group size. With a traditional prong style rest, I am able to fine tune and noticeabley improve group size.

Maybe I was not setting the drop away rest up correctly ( Trophy Taker ) but I seem to be " MORE" accurate with my " old faithful" . I don' t see how set up is any easier with a drop away rest either. They both have to be set for center shot. How does a mechanical part make that any easier?

Don' t get me wrong. I didn' t have any problems hunting with the Trophy Taker. Killed 3 deer so I can' t really complain. I just didn' t see any advantages that would warrant spending the money for high dollar rest that could potentially fail.

Orions_Bow

I am still a big fan of launcher style rests. I currently like to use rests like the GKF Royal Hunter, Platinum Premier, and Golden premier. I have shot fall aways also and they do work but for hunting I mostly like simple & easy and the rests I mentioned give me that. When I hunt I don' t like to worry about anything & the simpler the better!

I do have one bow right now that is set up with a fall away. on that bow I found it worked rather well but honestly I shoot the same with or without a fall away. The main reason I use the fall away on this bow is that I wanted to shoot a super light carbon over 300fps with a very hard helical & 4" fletch. I was just looking for a fast & easy to tune rest that would give me no fletching contact with this setup. I also used a fall away that has a built in guard (Mirage) which for this bow I felt was something I wanted since it had a very small shelf.

I do think sometimes it is an easy solution to correct fletching contact for your average person that isn' t going to spend a great deal of time tuning their bow. I really think the main thing is having faith in your equipment. If a shooter uses a fall away and has faith in it because they think they shoot better this is a good thing and that person will have better success.

Pinwheel 12

WV Hunter-

I choose not to comment on any particular brand, as I stated above my post was/is not to promote and/or degrade any one particular brand or model but to comment on technical issues of fall aways in general. I will simply say that the MZE is indeed a fall away design, and thus must be considered such when comparing them to other designs. Good shooting, Pinwheel 12

Fletchead

Eight degrees of heli is the ultimate for spin on broadheads. The closer to that, the better. Ive yet to see the shoot through that can handle that with a skinny carbon. I dont beleive you will ever see a gain in accuracy with fieldpoints. I do believe anyone will see a gain in accuracy with more heli, and a proper setup with a dropaway and broadheads. I dont see how shooting the proper amount of heli the only way you can with carbons could be considered a bandaid. Where do yo draw the line there with bandaids Pin. Creep tuning is a bandaid. A stabilizer is a bandaid. Hell, a release is a bandaid. Pretty much anything that lets you shoot better and more consistant is a bandaid. Do they cure form problems. No, thats not their intention. You had also better have proper spine, or with a dropaway you will compound the problems. Nope they dont let you get a way with or help when, torqueing, flinching, punching the trigger, dropping your bow arm, etc, or a crappy tuned bow. They do let you shoot more helical, and hey that cant be bad.

Rangeball

Pinwheel, the primary attribute I like about a drop away design is the ability to use a launcher or assembly that fully cradles and supports the arrow while at rest and full draw, but is out of the way to provide adequate clearance at launch. To me, this is a highly valued feature for a hunting bow in a field situation.

Given the recent trend to design fixed position rests that provide this cradling support through launch (bodoodle, GKF Shoot out, WB, etc), based on your experience and knowledge can you please expand on what particular qualities one should look for in such type of rest, and possibly use some examples of current models available that fit the bill?

Please?

Pinwheel 12

Fletchead-

I have yet to shoot a conventional rest such as a bodoodle or GKF that will not allow me to use as much helical as is " fletchingly" possible. Fletchers will only helical so far, and the arrow will not start to spin until it is well clear of the rest and bow anyway, so that is of no concern. I shot full helical off of springy' s, flippers, and other rests back the " old days" with no adverse affects other than possible wear on the vanes or feathers themselves, so any shoot-through today that is well tuned will throw a helical fine also. If you tune the bow, you tune the bow, regardless of rest contact or not, and as long as it is consistent and not sporadic, it will shoot. I have seen a bow that was tuned to perfection that had a recurve limb on one end, straight on the other, cam on one end, wheel on the other, both of different poundages, shooting a full helical arrow through a TM hunter, and shot perfect holes!! (I know other techs who read these threads have also) Now, having said that, yes, an arrow that will offer no fletching contact (and even balance of limb, cams and whatnot) will ultimately shoot better, but I find this not to be a problem nowadays with most any convnetional rests, and the support feature that help the paradox is a biggie that cannot be overlooked, IMHO.

Rangeball-

I have found best results with rests such as the GKF Golden Premier series, (micro-adjustable) as well as the Bodoodle,(altho not micro-adjustable) and even recently became a " tentative fan" of the WB (for hunting only tho!) after running them through the mill. In their case I normally do not like shooting arrows through any medium on their way to the target, but flight on these rests is not hugely affected and you only lose a few feet in speed. they are not as accurate as other rests, but are capable in close-range hunting situations. I do feel any arrow needs to paradox without " full" restriction as found in some of the " full capture rests" , but yet IMO offers better performance when it is supported only from one side which will help it to stabilize faster and give it " purpose" , yet still have the freedom to paradox. without too much interference. I again must emphasize that if you guys feel that the fallaways are the cat' s butt and you want to shoot them, by all means do so, it' s a free country! I am merely giving my opinions and reasonings as to why I do not recommend them or shoot them myself. Good shooting, Pinwheel 12

Fletchead

Pin, Like always, good points.I understand the arrow doesnt spin till past the riser, but its still got to pass through those prongs for consistant flight, or hit the same way every time.I see your point, but do you tune for the fletch to always hit a little, or hope for a complete pass through. At longer distances my b.hd. groups have tightened considerably, and thats where you will see the gain. At twenty yds. I think I could get an untuned dynabo to group well with a cut down beer can for a capture rest.Its out past fourty where Ive seen a difference. Every arrow flys excactly the same.Im shooting six degrees through a Qt 1000 with g.t. xts. Very little room for error. Can it be done through a prong. Obviously. I used to do it but it was a constant battle from one arrow to the next and regardless of how well tuned the bow is, if youve got fletch bangin the prongs b.h. flight is sporadic.I dont have time to worry about,are all the nocks tuned perfectly while bustin through the woods and plum thickets. With a drop away it gives me one less thing to worry about. As far as it being bullet proof. I converted mine to a dropaway. Changed the spring, and use loop cord for the connection.Spring tension is spring tension. Doesnt matter if its holding up or pulling down. Ive never had a loop let go either, if you service it properly, so I dont see that being unreliable either. Going on a year now, probably about 80 days in the field last year hunting, and targets every other day.Not a hiccup at all so far. I used to have the same attitude that someone else mentioned. If you know how to tune, you dont need the damn thing. I hate change. Now Ive proven to myself otherwise, and wouldnt switch back. Once again Pin, not trying to argue.Just stating what works for me. I see all your points and am always informed and enlightened when you respond.


I forgot to mention Pin that Ive got mine set so it is completely free about three inches in front of the fletch. I think thats very important. You dont want them going out of the way to quick. Does more harm than good, especially will some of the older one cams with the windmill nock travel. Yeah I know Pin, compared with a two, evey one cam is a windmill. We better not go there. It did take a while, to figure it out. Foot spray on the shaft, finding the proper length for the cord, and placement on the cable. I almost gave up a couple of times. Since this was a do it yourself deal, there were no instructions. Not that it matters. Cant read anyway. Believe me I keep all those measurements written down.