Feathers going left??
07-01-2008, 06:01 PM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 128
Feathers going left??
I took some serious extra time this year paper tuning my bow. I bare shaft tune to the point I was getting a near perfect bullet hole. I then began shooting my East Axis 400's w/ 2" blazers and was getting 4" groups at 40 yards. I decided to try my 4" feathered arrows at the same distance and although I still was able to consistently get a 4" grouping, all the feathered arrows were grouping about 6-8" straight to the left. I can not for the life of me figure out why. I could understand up or down based on a weight difference between 2" vanes and 4" feathers ( Although minimal ) I can not come up with a valid reason for directly left by that much. Any ideas anyone?
07-01-2008, 06:46 PM
#2
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Where the ducks don't come no more
Posts: 4,420
RE: Feathers going left??
I have a theory, but I honestly don't know if the weights in question here would throw it 6-8" left....but here it goes.
Adding/subtracting weight to the back of your arrow will effect your spine just as much as adding/subtracting weight to the front. The difference between 3 blazers and 3 feathers is only 12 grains though... I honestly don't know if thats enough to make THAT MUCH of a difference. I would have thought that at 40 yards the feathers would have impacted much much LOWER than the blazers... usually they are dead even to 30 yards but past that feathers start slowing down a lot quicker than anything else. Thats the only thing I can think of unless you are getting contact with the blazers on your cables or something.
Adding/subtracting weight to the back of your arrow will effect your spine just as much as adding/subtracting weight to the front. The difference between 3 blazers and 3 feathers is only 12 grains though... I honestly don't know if thats enough to make THAT MUCH of a difference. I would have thought that at 40 yards the feathers would have impacted much much LOWER than the blazers... usually they are dead even to 30 yards but past that feathers start slowing down a lot quicker than anything else. Thats the only thing I can think of unless you are getting contact with the blazers on your cables or something.
07-01-2008, 09:01 PM
#3
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Feathers going left??
I would have thought that at 40 yards the feathers would have impacted much much LOWER than the blazers... usually they are dead even to 30 yards but past that feathers start slowing down a lot quicker than anything else.
I can only guess that your bow tune was never quite right in the first place, WBowhunt. Probably, as Swamp Collie said, you were getting vane contact some how or other.
07-01-2008, 09:16 PM
#4
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Where the ducks don't come no more
Posts: 4,420
RE: Feathers going left??
ORIGINAL: Arthur P
That's totally incorrect. Urban myth perpetuated on the internet. Feathers and vanes will shoot very close to the same POI out to at least 80 yards. No sweat. I shot field archery competition for years using feathers for dry weather and vanes in damp weather, with no need for any corrections whatsoever. I'm far from the only one to do the same, with the same results.
I can only guess that your bow tune was never quite right in the first place, WBowhunt. Probably, as Swamp Collie said, you were getting vane contact some how or other.
I would have thought that at 40 yards the feathers would have impacted much much LOWER than the blazers... usually they are dead even to 30 yards but past that feathers start slowing down a lot quicker than anything else.
I can only guess that your bow tune was never quite right in the first place, WBowhunt. Probably, as Swamp Collie said, you were getting vane contact some how or other.
Dang arthur.... I look up to your tech skills... but mine are WAY different. Now, I tend to put a fair piece of helical on mine (feathers)... would that make the difference compared to a straight offset blazer? Mine at 40 are like 4-5" different.
07-01-2008, 09:37 PM
#5
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Feathers going left??
You can put way too much helical on fletching, actually to the point the fletching acts like a parachute instead of steerage. I've seen so much helical that when you look down the shaft, the back end of one feather overlaps the line with the front end of the feather next to it by quite a bit. Sure does stabilize an arrow quick and makes big 2-blade broadheads fly good with minimal tuning, but it really erodes downrange performance. Traditional shooters are the world's worst about that.
It also makes feathers noisier than need be in flight, hence that other popular myth. You really don't need very much helical to get the job done, as long as the bow is tuned and the arrow is the right spine.
It also makes feathers noisier than need be in flight, hence that other popular myth. You really don't need very much helical to get the job done, as long as the bow is tuned and the arrow is the right spine.
07-02-2008, 08:31 AM
#6
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Where the ducks don't come no more
Posts: 4,420
RE: Feathers going left??
ORIGINAL: Arthur P
You can put way too much helical on fletching, actually to the point the fletching acts like a parachute instead of steerage. I've seen so much helical that when you look down the shaft, the back end of one feather overlaps the line with the front end of the feather next to it by quite a bit. Sure does stabilize an arrow quick and makes big 2-blade broadheads fly good with minimal tuning, but it really erodes downrange performance. Traditional shooters are the world's worst about that.
It also makes feathers noisier than need be in flight, hence that other popular myth. You really don't need very much helical to get the job done, as long as the bow is tuned and the arrow is the right spine.
You can put way too much helical on fletching, actually to the point the fletching acts like a parachute instead of steerage. I've seen so much helical that when you look down the shaft, the back end of one feather overlaps the line with the front end of the feather next to it by quite a bit. Sure does stabilize an arrow quick and makes big 2-blade broadheads fly good with minimal tuning, but it really erodes downrange performance. Traditional shooters are the world's worst about that.
It also makes feathers noisier than need be in flight, hence that other popular myth. You really don't need very much helical to get the job done, as long as the bow is tuned and the arrow is the right spine.
Good to know.... I think I've been over-doing mine for a long time. I would liken mine to a pin-wheel or a boat motor prop.
Thanks Arthur.
07-02-2008, 12:08 PM
#7
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: TX Panhandle
Posts: 620
RE: Feathers going left??
Soooo.... Sayon a bitz jig set the offset to 0 and just use the normal helical clamp. It that what you are saying Arthur? Or would you kick in a little offset? My bow is in tune pretty well, I will be shooting a big fixed blade, but plan on limiting shots to about 25 yards. Shooting in the 265 fps range.
07-02-2008, 05:11 PM
#8
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Feathers going left??
I had to pull out my bitz to see where I've got it set. Haven't done any fletching in quite awhile.[&:]
Mine is set at 0 on top and offset about 2 line thicknesses off 0 on bottom. But I think I had it set for cedar arrows. I think those were the last ones I did. So... Your mileage may vary.
Mine is set at 0 on top and offset about 2 line thicknesses off 0 on bottom. But I think I had it set for cedar arrows. I think those were the last ones I did. So... Your mileage may vary.
07-02-2008, 06:04 PM
#9
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 128
RE: Feathers going left??
Thanks for the Theories. Now I have another excuse to play. I do have a greater helical on my feathers than Blazers, more I think due to the 2" vs 4" length of the feather. It was a thought I had when I was shooting the groups, but to be honest it just seemed too simple. I have not been shooting feathers on my compound for long. I usually only use them on my recurve, but decided to play some with it to see for myselfthe internet urban legend on dropping and weather was true.Just to clarify the poor rest contact issue though. I am shooting a Carbon whisker biscuit ( I suppose I should have mentioned that in the original post ) And I am getting great arrow flight and there is no way I could be getting cable contact on the Vectrix. They are just to far. I am going to play with refletching some feathers this weekend at different offsets and see what my results will be. This is one reason I love to practice out at40 - 80 yards. Little things show up a lot better the further you go away from the target and if I am shooting a nice group that far away, I feel much more confident at my 25 yard max hunting range.