Carbon vs aluminum arrows
10-12-2007, 11:14 PM
#32
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Carbon vs aluminum arrows
Shoot what you want I don't care, some poeple just try to hang on to there older ways,things, are unwilling to make a change and do there best to put down others who don't do things there way.
Being a reasonably intelligent person, I try out new things and make decisions about them based on how stuff performs for me. I retain what works better and discard anything that doesn't work at least as well as what I already use.
Carbon works better for me on the 3D range when I'm trying to win a trophy. Aluminum works better for me in the woods, when I need an arrow to carry a broadhead straight and true. If I've got my longbow in my hands, my quiver will be loaded with POC wood arrows, and I even prefer THEM to carbon when it comes to shooting broadheads. Like hammers, wrenches and screwdrivers, I see them as different tools for different jobs.
Other than wood, the only non-aluminum arrow I'll even consider hunting with is a carbon/fiberglass composite. The old Carbon Express Terminator Selects were some fine hunting arrows. Much more consistent and far more durable than any all-carbon arrow I've ever tried. The closest I ever found to being nearly the equal of aluminum. Still got a half dozen I've been saving for a special occasion.
But there we are again. Old stuff. Carbon composite arrows have been around since the 70's, haven't they. Being an old fart like me, surely you remember the Graphlex brand arrows?
10-13-2007, 07:52 AM
#33
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central Minnesota
Posts: 9,445
RE: Carbon vs aluminum arrows
ORIGINAL: bowdoc1
Steve S come on have you ever tryed to take a carbon in your hands and brake it. When I did shoot aluminums I always liked the older game getters because they didn't brake as fast in game and would bend farther before they broke not as fast as the xx75s or the xx78s because of the alloy.Your freind must be shooting a light poundage recurve are somthing to get a arrow to stay in it and to brake it. With a 70 lbs compound are back when I shot a 60 to 65 lb pound recurves aluminums almost alway brake off if they don't pass through, 100 of times I seen them brake on impack are when the deer takes off it brakes off and falls to the ground. Aluminums arrow you don't haft to bent very far and they will brake or they will bent and are no good any more. There is not a thing wrong with hunting with them I have taken alots of big game with both, even with wood arrows. I did at one time get arrow free or almost free arrows from diferant companies, so got to test them a lot in my bows and a shooting machine. I just love the penetration and the durability carbons have over aluminums. On deer trials just shoot through them and stick the arrow in the ground and you can see them go down most of the time and there is all kinds of blood on carbon arrow. I can't remimber having to trial a deer very far for a long time out of 50 or 60 deer any way most of the bowhunters I hunt with get pass throughs and the ones that havn't we didn't have any problems finding blood on the carbons arrows, are had the carbon brake off not to say it couldn't happen just I never seen it in the few time that I have see the carbon arrow that stayed in a deer. With the blood it will be on your vanes are feather it dosn't make a diffrance what they are on carbon are aluminum and the broadhead make the blood trial on the ground not the arrow the only way the arrow helps is by passing through making the exit hole, but I have never had a problem seeing blood on carbons. Shoot what you want I don't care, some poeple just try to hang on to there older ways,things, are unwilling to make a change and do there best to put down others who don't do things there way. Just do your best to made clean kill you owe it to the game you hunt and most of all you owe it to yourself to be the best you can be at your sport. The last 40 years I eat and sleep archery I work hard to be at my best at my sport and will to the day I die.
Steve S come on have you ever tryed to take a carbon in your hands and brake it. When I did shoot aluminums I always liked the older game getters because they didn't brake as fast in game and would bend farther before they broke not as fast as the xx75s or the xx78s because of the alloy.Your freind must be shooting a light poundage recurve are somthing to get a arrow to stay in it and to brake it. With a 70 lbs compound are back when I shot a 60 to 65 lb pound recurves aluminums almost alway brake off if they don't pass through, 100 of times I seen them brake on impack are when the deer takes off it brakes off and falls to the ground. Aluminums arrow you don't haft to bent very far and they will brake or they will bent and are no good any more. There is not a thing wrong with hunting with them I have taken alots of big game with both, even with wood arrows. I did at one time get arrow free or almost free arrows from diferant companies, so got to test them a lot in my bows and a shooting machine. I just love the penetration and the durability carbons have over aluminums. On deer trials just shoot through them and stick the arrow in the ground and you can see them go down most of the time and there is all kinds of blood on carbon arrow. I can't remimber having to trial a deer very far for a long time out of 50 or 60 deer any way most of the bowhunters I hunt with get pass throughs and the ones that havn't we didn't have any problems finding blood on the carbons arrows, are had the carbon brake off not to say it couldn't happen just I never seen it in the few time that I have see the carbon arrow that stayed in a deer. With the blood it will be on your vanes are feather it dosn't make a diffrance what they are on carbon are aluminum and the broadhead make the blood trial on the ground not the arrow the only way the arrow helps is by passing through making the exit hole, but I have never had a problem seeing blood on carbons. Shoot what you want I don't care, some poeple just try to hang on to there older ways,things, are unwilling to make a change and do there best to put down others who don't do things there way. Just do your best to made clean kill you owe it to the game you hunt and most of all you owe it to yourself to be the best you can be at your sport. The last 40 years I eat and sleep archery I work hard to be at my best at my sport and will to the day I die.
10-13-2007, 08:07 AM
#34
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central Minnesota
Posts: 9,445
RE: Carbon vs aluminum arrows
ORIGINAL: stalkingbear
I have tried both side by side and in fact started using aluminum arrows before they even came out with carbon arrows. As to blood trail,exit hole is more important than arrow staying in game for broadhead doing more damage.
All of the game animals I've gotten in the last 15 years have dropped while still within sight-even elk and russian boar. The pure and simple facts are that carbon arrows are superior in almost every way for hunting as opposed to aluminum. On the argument that they ain't straight or spined properly all the way around,that issue is pretty well dead with today's modern improvments in design and manufacturing. I do buy top of the line carbon shafts-you get what you pay for. It DOES take a lot more for carbon arrows to break than aluminum wether hitting a hard surface or still in animal. We ain't gunna change each other's minds on this so let's give up and agree to disagree. I'm speaking from experience and ain't trying to promote outdated equipment from personal preference-just stating facts as my own experience has proven over the years. To each his own and whatever works for YOU-just please don't try to mislead new bowhunters into making mistakes so you may add a feather in your cap.
I have tried both side by side and in fact started using aluminum arrows before they even came out with carbon arrows. As to blood trail,exit hole is more important than arrow staying in game for broadhead doing more damage.
All of the game animals I've gotten in the last 15 years have dropped while still within sight-even elk and russian boar. The pure and simple facts are that carbon arrows are superior in almost every way for hunting as opposed to aluminum. On the argument that they ain't straight or spined properly all the way around,that issue is pretty well dead with today's modern improvments in design and manufacturing. I do buy top of the line carbon shafts-you get what you pay for. It DOES take a lot more for carbon arrows to break than aluminum wether hitting a hard surface or still in animal. We ain't gunna change each other's minds on this so let's give up and agree to disagree. I'm speaking from experience and ain't trying to promote outdated equipment from personal preference-just stating facts as my own experience has proven over the years. To each his own and whatever works for YOU-just please don't try to mislead new bowhunters into making mistakes so you may add a feather in your cap.
10-13-2007, 08:43 AM
#35
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,175
RE: Carbon vs aluminum arrows
I wholeheartedly agree with you, Schultzy. Shooting quality arrows, whatever material they're made from, is never a mistake. We're talking personal preference here. So, I think somebody needs to pluck a feather from his own bonnet due to presenting his personal preference as immutable fact. [8D]
Now, I strongly suspect that somebody has taken ultralight, thin walled aluminums, the stuff a whole lot of people were shooting in the 80's to pick up speed, and comparing those things to carbons. 2213's were really popular with the speed crowd before carbons. Cut short and shot on 5" overdraws to get spined out right, they were quick. Without a doubt carbons are far more durable than those, but it certainly doesn't apply across the board to all aluminums.
I tried a dozen 2213's set up like that from my 80 pound Hoyt. By the end of the first day of shooting them, not a single one from a dozen were still shootable. All were wrinkled and at least 1/4" shorter than they were at the start of the day. They had actually accordian-ed in on themselves from being shot at excelsior target butts.
Having learned a lesson from that day, I never went that route again. I stuck with mid to heavy weight aluminums, at least 22/64ths diameter and no thinner than .015" wall thickness. I would put arrows like 2315's, 2317's and 2419's up against carbons for durability any day of the week. 2216's and 2219's are ever so slightly lower on the durability scale. Heavy and slow by comparison, but whatever they hit STAYS hit. Those are the arrows I was referring to when I talked about my destructive testing comparison experiments.
Now, I strongly suspect that somebody has taken ultralight, thin walled aluminums, the stuff a whole lot of people were shooting in the 80's to pick up speed, and comparing those things to carbons. 2213's were really popular with the speed crowd before carbons. Cut short and shot on 5" overdraws to get spined out right, they were quick. Without a doubt carbons are far more durable than those, but it certainly doesn't apply across the board to all aluminums.
I tried a dozen 2213's set up like that from my 80 pound Hoyt. By the end of the first day of shooting them, not a single one from a dozen were still shootable. All were wrinkled and at least 1/4" shorter than they were at the start of the day. They had actually accordian-ed in on themselves from being shot at excelsior target butts.
Having learned a lesson from that day, I never went that route again. I stuck with mid to heavy weight aluminums, at least 22/64ths diameter and no thinner than .015" wall thickness. I would put arrows like 2315's, 2317's and 2419's up against carbons for durability any day of the week. 2216's and 2219's are ever so slightly lower on the durability scale. Heavy and slow by comparison, but whatever they hit STAYS hit.
Those are the arrows I was referring to when I talked about my destructive testing comparison experiments.
