bigcountry

Guys, maybe I read this wrong. But the poster asked what is respectable speed, not what is the minimum, or what will penetrate best or most what people is replying. maybe I am reading it wrong.

eelriver

Yes; a 500 grain arrow going 150 fps will kill a deer assuming you are close enough and the shot is well placed. Obviously the faster the arrow the flatter it's flight path, giving accuracy at distance.

How fast is fast enough? Well, speed=$......I would say your arrow should be going as fast as you can afford.

Straightarrow

Well, what exactly does respectable mean? I would hope it wasn't just for bragging rights on who has the fastest arrow. In a hunting situation with a hunting arrow, I can't think of a single situation where the yardage is known, that a heavier, slower arrow will not out-perform a lighter, faster arrow unless the arrow weight was extreme for a given setup. I'm talking about ease of hitting the right spot, penetration, stability or any other factor important in killing game. I've shot 950 grain arrows out of my 60 lb compound and trajectory was no problem at typical hunting ranges. I know of guys frequently taking big game with 1500 grain arrows. An arrow has to go awful slow before trajectory becomes real concern at known distances.

If the speed concern is simply to help those who don't know the yardage, it becomes a poor bandaid for an easily overcome problem.

tremolo

Well i guess i did start a little trouble. I think that my bow was shooting around 220 when i was last hunting a few years ago which i know will kill a deer. I was just curious how much faster they are now. Are you guys shooting at 250ish or closer to 300? i know that Ke is the knock down power that you have and i would assume that if you guys are using these for hunting then everything checks out.I know that no one (well maybe someone is)is shooting IBO speeds in a hunting setup and that older bows were shooting in the 100s. I just want to know how fast are they now.

Straightarrow

Speed does not equal knock down power with an arrow. Arrows kill by cutting. Ashby has demostrated that KE has no correlation to penetration (cutting). These are the myths that Ashby is trying to dispell.

By the way, you didn't start trouble. You started a good discussion that needs to take place over and over until more people learn the finer points of arrow lethality. I for one, have learned a tremendous amount from Ashby's studies.

Straightarrow

I forgot to answer your question.

My current compound (2007 model) at 60 lbs and 29" draw length, is sending my arrow at a blistering 205 fps. I've always limited my shot distance to about 30 yards on whitetails. If a deer offers me a shot opportunity inside that, it doesn't stand a chance.

bigcountry

Yea, I have seen you preach this over and over. I understand its very important to you that others shoot 12 or even 15gr/lb of pull. But are you not overthinking alot of this? I mean was you having that much trouble penetrating deer when you shot fast? No matter if I am shooting 300fps with a 350gr arrow, or 220fps with a 600gr arrow, I can't say I have that much of an issue with deer. Of course if I am going elk hunting, I like a beefier setup.

I shoot longbow, and thats where your argument shines and makes alot of sense. But compounds, doesn't really matter much, does it?

eelriver

Straightarrow

I hope I’m consistant, just like those who preach that it doesn’t matter much what a person shoots. Everything works and there is no best way. Although I agree almost anything can work, there most certainly is a “best way”.

You understand wrong. It is important to me that people understand that the bow means almost nothing. The arrow is however, extremely important. I want them to know how important correct spine is, how much more forgiving very high FOC is and how weight/FOC affects penetration. I want them to know that if they have a low draw weight or short draw length or they’re hunting really big game that weight is not their enemy. It’s their friend. I want them to know if they hit heavy bone, that weight is a big advantage.

About the only info they get from most websites or manufacturers leave them clueless in these areas. Either that, or the information is just plain wrong.


Yes, I was. I wondered why 35 years ago, most of my shots from a 45 lb recurve were passthroughs, and a good percentage of my shots from a 70 lb compound were not. I wondered why so many TV hunters showed video of close range shots with absolutely horrible penetration on rib cage hits on whitetails. I wondered how a 70 lb compound shooting 280 fps sometimes didn’t pass through the ribs of an immature whitetail. There was tons of evidence of poor penetration to make me do a lot of thinking – and experimenting. It was the actual implementation of Ashby’s recommendations that was eye-opening for me.

I also came to realize that I didn’t want to shoot what worked on ribcages, but not on shoulder bones. I wanted an arrow that had a better chance of working on shots hitting heavier bone.

I think the bow is completely irrelevant. In other words, the principles of arrow lethality remain the same, no matter the bow used. Longbow or compound, spine, weight, FOC are all still just as important.

brucelanthier

I used to wonder that too, being fairly new to bowhunting, but after reading information from you and others like you I no longer wonder about that. I also don't wonder whether my 534 grain 17%FOC arrow will do the job either .

Keep preaching Straightarrow, newcomers like myself need to hear it.