Rick James

Has anyone tuned the tiller settings on a 04' Patriot s/c and happened to find a "sweet spot"?

I am having trouble with a nock high tear on mine that appeared out of no where and can't seem to tune it out perfectly. The bow shoots where it is pointed, however knowing that it isn't tearing perfect drives my nuts to think about. No matter where I adjust the rest or loop/nock point I can't seem to dial it out. I have to replace the nock loop this week before my next event next weekend due to wear and hope to tune this nock high tear out of it before then as well as add a 50 and 60 pin to my bow for long range practice and our local "Lost Arrow" league.

All my other specs seems to be dead on with when my last new string went on and the peep hasn't turned at all, so I am convinced that it is tiller since it is the only thing I have messed with since it was last shooting bullet holes.


Any experience from someone that has actually done this on a Patriot?

gibblet

where's your nock pt set, level, 1/8" high, 3/8" high? you may very well be bouncing off the shelf if you're not nock high with the dz or your rest may not be up long enough or too long, or your grip could be incorrect - have you changed your grip?. have you tried putting 1/4 turn in the top limb bolt? are you shooting level at paper? you got vapor trail right? i doubt that has anything to do with it. i took a couple of them apart when i was learning to pick up some tricks and they're nice. tried messing with the distance the rest is from the shelf?

but usually when you can't get rid of a nock high with a fall away the back of the arrow is bouncing off of something.

Rick James

Hah......I knew you would show up in this thread. Thanks for the suggestions.

The nock has been everywhere from level to 1/4" high. Last time I had it shooting bullet holes, it was at 1/8" high. That is where it is now.

The rest may not be up long enough, however I know it is not up too long as I watch it when I draw and the launcher arm is inside the rest before half draw if I were to let it down and watch it. I will have to mess with the timing a bit and see if it is dropping too quickly.

The first time I had it shooting bullet holes, there was a 1/2 turn extra in the top limb. I need to confirm that it is still there now, as I think that is where it is now, not sure though.

Yes, it is all Vapor trail for now.......no complaints there and it all seems to be rock solid (although I will be using yours next time around.......

I will begin to tear into it tomorrow and will post any updates.

With that said, the bow is still shooting where it is pointed. I took 3rd place in a shoot this weekend, and 5th in another shoot that had over 50 shooters in MBR with me so the bow is shooting well. It just plays mind games with me when I know it isn't tearing bullet holes.

DaveC

Can't help too much with the tuning, but are you shooting the turnies at 74#( as in your signiture)?

I'm guessing 74# was maxed out and now it is not since you had 1/2 more turns in the top than the bottom?

My Pat had a terrible rip a week or so ago i couldn't cure. Took it to the bow shop- no adjustments and presto- pefrect bullets with both a 400 and 340 bemans. The only thing I could figure was the shops paper tuner is mounted high so you can aim square at it. I was lazy at home and didn't feel like stacking targets so i just set mine up to where I was aiming down. I hope that was it, I never rechecked once I got home.

Glad to hear your doing well with yours!

Rick James

Well tonight I had do tie on a new loop, and drop the poundage down to 71 lbs since I just fletched up and built some lighter 358 grain Pro 22's (these should be smoking now ). I planned on retuning the bow then and trying once again to get it to shoot bullet holes. I got all specs on nock point (1/8" up), and tiller (1/4 turn less poundage on bottom limb) set and then took it to the paper and somehow miraculously on the first shot it shot a bullet hole. It now shoots bullet holes from 3 feet away all the way out to 35 yards. What are the chances of that?

Don't know what exactly what happened but the bow is shooting very well now and I love it. The thing that sucks is that the bow down at 71 lbs doesn't seem to have enough holding weight because of the high letoff I have a problem settling on the spot. I may try the 29 1/2" module on it and see if I can adjust the draw stop so that it has less letoff. The 29" feels a bit short to me anyhow.......I have ape arms for a 6' tall guy so hopefully I can get less letoff and another 1/4" of draw with the 29 1/2" module. I might just pick up a few fps...............

gibblet

i'm at the point where trying to tune is useless. i backed my patriot down to 60 pounds, put on some wild looking 3 color strings (i admit it - making so many strings for target shooters has got me liking fancy colors) and bought a tru-ball ultra 3 pure back tension release. i was at a weekend seminar with larry wise and 7 other students and am now dedicated to learning back tension. we never shot an arrow past 5 yards all weekend. i can shoot about 15 arrows great, and that's it, i start fighting it. i start blank baleing, then shoot a few 20 yarders and a few 40 yarders, and then some closed eye blank baleing, and by then i can't feel those muscles that i'm supposed to be tightening, and i'm tightening the ones i'm supposed to be relaxing... but the bt is going better than before i had instruction - i'll say that much - so i kind of envy your tuning issues, and your sweeeeet success. and big ups for the way your doing in your shoots. that's awesome!

Rick James

Ha, thanks....much appreciated. I am happy as well with this year considering it has been quite a few years since I did anything competitive. I got a chance to shoot a TRU Ball Sweet Spot Ultra 4 BT release last weekend. Let me tell you what.........I want one of those SO bad right now but am having a hard time justifying another $150 after I just bought my Ultra Extreme. It felt so good, and I have recently developed a BAD habit of punching the occasional trigger which definately hurts my 3D scores. I usually drop around 5-10 points per shoot doing this.......[:@] I am thinking about just selling my Ultra Extreme and then buying the Sweet Spot, but I am not sure if I want to make that kind of commitment to BT yet..........

gibblet

i would have gone for the sweet spot, but the guys there said i'd be ok without it. and i saved $. i have experienced premature evacuation once (of the arrow), but that's it. there's a groove where you put your thumb when drawing and it won't let it fire because of the angle if you put your thumb there.

DaveC

Well I''m fighting the good fight again. I'm almost too embarassed to post this, but my PM won't let me send out.
Trying to get my Patriot to shoot big broadheads accurately is like trying to sqeeze blood from a turnip.

No matter what I try my bow shoot's the arrows tail left. Broadheads group to the right(~6" @ 20 yards).Rest in, rest out, 75 grain tips instead of 100's, not torquing the bow. (Lipstick shows no fletching contact on the rest.)
It's an underspine reaction, but I'm shooting 65# 29" and can't see where
Beman 340's w/100 grain tips could be underspined.
I also have someEaston 400's that tail left also.

Ithink the main problem is my inability to tune the drop zone properly.
I'm to the point ofswitching the DZ to a containment rest(WB) in hopes of calming the arrow down as it leaves.

Any tips I haven't tried?? I'm grabbing at straws here[&o](again)

gibblet

when i get lost like that i start over. i put the arrows away and i re-set up the rest to laser centershot, or close, re-time it. re-set my nock pt to 1/8" high, and just start completely over tuning broadheads only with the super-tuning method. once those broadheads are tuned i could care less where field pts hit. when i shoot field pts i only care that they group at that pt. sometimes i get lost as heck. for whatever reason, that works for me.