dpv

Butch, I know what you mean. Can't tell you how many hunts have been ruined by someone's dogs. What pisses me off the most is having them run the dogs before firearms deer season starts, to "warm up the dogs" And the worst part is sometimes they will run the dogs on public land where I hunt so they don't stir up the deer on the private land they plan to hunt later. I can't even formulate the words to discribe what I think of that.
All I can say is if it's a doe day or a day that you expect them to be running dogs, either hunt really far from where they will be, or set up an ambush that will use their dogs to push the deer to you. I did that last year and scored on a button during rifle season. They pushed the deer right to me. The guys running the dogs were ok with it and one of them even helped me pick up the blood trail after I lost it for a bit. Deer wasn't far, but the brush was thick. You never know. it might work. IT's not that majestic scene where you have stalked or patterned the deer for weeks/months and then you cleany take him with one stealthy arrow or rifle shot, but it's meat in the freezer and that ain't bad.

David

Roost em 1st

HMMMMMM!!! If patience is a virtue and deerdogva has enough to hunt all day with a muzzleloader... what transforms him during modern gun. WARNING: THIS MAN MAY HAVE RABIES EVIDENCED BY BEHAVIORAL PATTERNS SUBJECT TO CHANGE FOR NO GOOD REASON!!!

DEERDOGVA- I'm just messing with ya but seriuosly if you do hunt with a muzzleloader all day don't you feel bad about ruining someones moderngun by running a bunch of dogs around em all day?

deerdogva

Well actually, not really, because most of the time when i'm running dogs there aren't many guys out there with bow and arrow. Thats why they have bow season a month earlier then general arms and muzzleloader season. it gives a chance for the guys to bow hunt with out any dogs around. and yes i do love to muzzleloader hunt. Most of the guys that do still hunt around it, love that we run dogs because they run the deer right to them. I mean think about if you own ten acres on the outside of a large parcel of a 1000 acres. which one do you think has more deer. So must of the time it works in advantage of the still hunter. every once in 100 hunts those dogs will go over to the ten acres jump a deer and it'll run back to them. So reality your winning every 99 out of hundred times? i mean i can truely understand if someone didn't want dogs on their property and if they didn't i would start at property line do a man drive along the edge of the two properties away from there property and then line that side up very well so when running dogs we wouldn't let the dogs ever get on their property. now i'm sure there would be a few exceptions but thats part of hunting. i would do everything in my power to try not to. but with our club its not about killing deer , it listening to the dogs, i would much rather take a friend with me and let him listen to some dogs run, then shoot a litlte buck or even a doe, i'd pass the shot up just to let the dogs keep going. Now i can see if you would get pissed off if you own 200 acres and a guy with 5 acres drops dogs on your property and surrounds your property. thats not the same dog hunting i'm talking about. That is wrong, but how we do it , there nothing wrong with it. I do wish the enforce NO ROAD HUNTING MORE. i to have some land and have had people with dogs throw dogs in road hunt it. So for those road hunters no i don't believe in that but i do belive in a deer dog chase. i hope i answered your question roost? i mean and even though i do muzzleloader hunt i don't hunt fields. I think shooting a deer over 50 yards anywhere takes no skill. it dosn't give the deer a fair chance but there another topic i'll save for later.

Roost em 1st

Well not really. You addressed the situation but confused modern gun with bow I think. maybe there should be a dog season and a modern gun.
I don't know what to think about the no skill comment at the end of your post. Running dogs takes a lot of precision skill I'm sure. Do you shoot the exhausted, meat filled with blood deer with a Muzzleloader? How does it taste?

ButchA

Good point, Roost 'em....

I would prefer a very calm, relaxed, deer any day of the week! I guess I just like the solitude of bowhunting when it's just you and a deer in a one-on-one situation. Sneaking into a deer livingroom undetected is the ultimate challenge from the very start.

I've had two deer opportunities so far this season.

Oct 6th: Little teeny tiny yearling doe walked within 25 yards of my stand. Cute little thing didn't even know I was there. Could I have taken her? Sure thing.... But she was all of about 60 pounds - if that. I chose to let her pass on by and test my patience and ability to stay quiet.

Oct 30th: Opening smokepole season. I don't own one, so I still bowhunted. I was in my favorite tree when someone was walking on the dirt road way down below my trail. They jumped a monster 8 pointer somehow, and it snuck up through the brush up over the trail by me and came to a stop directly behind me. I totally freaked out and tried to get a shot from 20 yards with my bow and missed! [:-][&o]

Now imagine being in a tree stand, re-living these two different events but yet have people out there running dogs at the same time. The quietness of the woods wouldn't exist. The deer wouldn't be peacefully walking around. They'd be jumpy, jittery, and running amok.

Butch A.

deerdogva

i'm sorry roost i did miss interrupt your question. but to answer your question , think about it for a minute. if we didn't have dog hunting, people would find something other way to make the woods unpieceful. You would still have hunters doing man drives blowing air horns through the woods. all kind of things to get the deer moving a little bit.
Private land is the only group that would really benifit from no dogs. but you would still have those clubs that are going to run dogs no matter what and i don't mean deer dogs. you get rid of deer dogs , they'll be having fox hunts or rabbits hunts or whatever the circumstances may be.the deer are more scared and jump more and less pieceful when general arms comes out. but thats not the only reason the other reason is because there are people in the woods. if you didn't have dog season you would have more people in the woods during blackpowder seaon and bow, which means that the deer might be scared anyways and people would start having man drives during black powder and during bow. So i think its better how it is now, where you know you'll have peace during bow and blackpowder or at least hope to. If you get rid of those you might not even have piece then. but what i was saying about towards the end of my last message is that alot guys hunt with rifles and even when black powder hunting and they'll shoot a deer 200 or 300 yards away. i don't feel that right but in alot of counties thats the only way they kill deer. But to get my point across i think everyone has their style of hunting. I like how the state has it set up right as far as season. However i do wish they would be harder on people that ROADHUNT. I love to dog hunt but I don't like ROADHUNTERS. its a little different if there is a guy standing out on the road waiting for the dogs just to catch the dogs. thats fine have no problem with that. but when they have the gun stretched out over the hood. thats never no good. but to what you were saying butch about sneaking up on deer. sneaking up on deer is alot easier to sneak up during general arms. They stay put longer, during black powder if i get with 50 yards while i'm walking usually they'll jump up. but during dog season deer tend not to jump up is quick and you can get closer before they move. because there is so much noise in the woods. Alot of times will still hunt during the week during general arms because we don't have enough people to let dogs out. I've walked up on many nice deer and sat almost right beside them and they wouldn't move till the were ready to move. but like i said i think its a personal choice what you like better. i like listening to the dogs run its a natural sound.... but that just my 3 cents sorry for being so long. any responses?

Roost em 1st

Listen i haven't lived in VA for 12 Autumns but what I remember about the land I hunted was that it was peaceful. Yes the OLD DOMINION fox hounds would cut through property but they published a schedule of where they were hunting that covered their entire season. All you had to do was avoid that spot where they were on any TUE THUR or SAT to enjoy a peaceful hunt in the woods. I don't know why you wouldn't want to wait your DOG SEASON until December when the rut slows. Probably wouldn't piss off as many hunters. You said yourself its about hearing the dogs whats it matter if you wait another month to do it?

deerdogva

but if you didn't have deer dogs then you would have a bunch of trashy fox dog hunters, so either way it won't work. those guys are going to be lazy and hunt any way they could and don't think for one minute that if there is a deer and front of those fox dogs then they wouldn't shoot it. So whatever you take from them there going to find some way to make it bad on you. So think about it, neither one of us have seen how it would be with out dog hunters, i think things would change but for the worst some people already don't like hunters if we start turning on each other too mcuh we won't get to hunt at all.
i agree with you to an extent about changing thing up a little . but then you would only get one month a year to run deer dogs? what would be the use having them keeping a dogs caged all up for one month a year? although most deer are killed with muzzleloaders or during the rut, maybe they should extend bow an extra two weeks. and then have two weeks of muzzleloader and then start dog hunting or better yet move the all hunting back two weeks. that way the bow hunters would get some of the early rut with no muzzleloader and then guys with muzzleloader would get a good portion of the rut and If you didn't start hunting dogs till december then have a month in like march just for that month have a chase only. i don't think there should be a general arm season though without dogs. because what can't you do with a black powder that you can do with a rifle? The only thing that i can think of is shoot 300 hundred yards and reload quick. which both don't give the deer a chance. I think the best solution is you can only hunt with shotguns when deer dog hunting and no road hunting and ENFORCE IT !!! that is the key. So what you think is it a good idea or do you still feel we need a general arms season with no dogs. heck iw ould even say extend black powder an extra week before general arms and cut one week off general arm season but not a whole month but if you take away time to hunt then we should get at least a chase only season . so what ya think ????

ButchA

How about if they make a new rule about certain days you can hunt with dogs (just like you have doe days)? I don't know... It's a thought that just came to me.

I was at Cumberland on Saturday and did two styles of hunting. In the AM, I used my Remington 870 12GA with 00 Buck and carefully, quietly, walked, and stalked on a nice out of the way trail. That came to an end though, when I was met by someone's hound dog. Cute little thing... Jumped on my leg, wanted to be petted, etc... Tag on the collar said "CH-7" with someone's last name and a phone number. I tried to shoo the dog away to rejoin the pack, but it kept hanging around with me. So, I just let things be and quietly walked the trail with this person's dog! Once I doubled back around and got back to my truck, the dog still wouldn't leave. I carefully had to get in my truck and not hit the dog while I left. Where were all the other dogs? Where was the hunter/owner? What, do they just open up the crates and dump the dogs out to them run wherever they want?

Anyway, I also did a nice afternoon hunt with my Marlin 30-30 in my treestand (yes you can rifle hunt in Cumberland - but you MUST be minimum 10 feet elevated above ground). I was in a nice spot (my #2 location) overlooking a big field. I heard dogs barking and bellowing all over the place. All over the ridges and hillsides, in the valleys, all over the place! I was all nice and comfortable in my Summit Viper, Marlin 30-30 laying crosswise across the bar, and I was just chillin' and enjoying the outdoors and the hunting experience. All of the sudden, I hear crashing in the woods about 50 yards diagonally from me, and see this big doe going Mach IV through the woods, briefly into the field and back into the woods, with a big pack of dogs on her tail. There was no way in hell I could get a shot off, because she was going like a horse in full gallop. I was in a nice ambush spot, so I stayed put. Not 45 minutes - 1 hour later, I hear another pack of dogs from another direction. Sure enough, here's another smaller doe at top speed, crashing through the brush, with a pack dogs on her heels too! Again, I couldn't get a shot off, because it was like trying to skeet shoot with a 30-30! I'm sorry, man, but maybe I just don't get it... WTF, you know?!?[:@] What is the purpose of running dogs after a deer making the deer run and run and and run and run until it can't run anymore? I want a deer to be drawn to my doe bleats and my Tinks #69 scent bomb, not be running by at 80 mph!

Check out my hunting log and you'll see my success rate (not!) so far.... [:-]

http://members.aol.com/ammonc/Hunting-log.html

I am going to take off Tuesday so it will be more quiet and I can go back out again and hopefully get something when it's more peaceful and quiet.

Butch A.

deerdogva

hey butch,
sorry you had a bad experience with the dog hunting. But did you get excited when you heard the dogs getting closer and closer? I didn't think you could shoot a doe this past saturday anyways. but like i said with dog hunting its about listening to the dogs run not always killing deer. but you just have to enjoy it i guess..... but if your hunting public land i would suggest hunting during the week or bring a shotgun, because most likely they'll have dogs running on it. sometimes when there running like that it you wistle or blow your bleat they will stop unless they have dogs right on them. but good luck sorry you had another bad experience.