Valley Forge hunt cancelled
12-30-2009, 04:27 PM
#51
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
You and RSB have the same problem. the deer didn't read and believe the same PGC propaganda you believe. In the 50's R. Latham said we would never have the deer we had in the 30s but just 20 years later the herd was just as large as it was in the 30s. Then, after being reduced in the 80s it rebounded once again in the 90's despite increased doe harvests.
Have you ever been to Latham's acre? The effects of deer can not be ignored.
Can you tell me the lack of ground cover is not an aggravating circumstance in the reduction of small game numbers across the state.
12-30-2009, 04:42 PM
#52
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
Why you refuse to see the damage that the deer have done is astonishing.
Have you ever been to Latham's acre? The effects of deer can not be ignored.
Can you tell me the lack of ground cover is not an aggravating circumstance in the reduction of small game numbers across the state
12-30-2009, 05:07 PM
#53
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
If anyone wants the habitat produced by zero deer, then they should fence their woods and keep out the deer. it is just like your solution of buying land to offset the effects of the PGC's HR.
Thee is no doubt that deer can contribute to the lack of understory in the seedling and sapling stage. But the limiting factor in pole and saw timber stands is the lack of sunlight due to a closed canopy. If you don't believe me check out the understory in a DCNR exclosure after 10 years.
12-30-2009, 05:18 PM
#54
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
You place no balance in your demand for more deer for you to see while your neighbor whom makes a living farming is quite happy with the deer plan.
No one has suggested "no deer" Latham's acre shows the difference between none and the varying numbers we have had over the last 60 years.
Once again go to Latham's acre and you will see that PA used to have plants that grew with little or no sunlight, like grouse they are a thing of the past.
12-30-2009, 05:29 PM
#55
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
Grouse are not a thing of the past and neither are trilliums. When I owned 87 acres in Lack. Co. we had lots of deer and lots of trilliums where trilliums were supposed to grow. but, 200 yds. away we had zero trilliums and it had nothing to do with too many deer.
Times have changed its you that refuse to.
Why would you ever sell your land?
12-30-2009, 05:42 PM
#56
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
"Have you ever been to Latham's acre? "
You gotta be kiddin' me.
Why dont we just go to "peta acres".
Im not disagreeing that deer can damage the habitat in high enough densities etc... But to credit that extremist for showing extreme unnatural examples of deerless habitat and pointing to it as ANY kind of proof of much of anything... To me is meaningless.
You gotta be kiddin' me.
Why dont we just go to "peta acres".
Im not disagreeing that deer can damage the habitat in high enough densities etc... But to credit that extremist for showing extreme unnatural examples of deerless habitat and pointing to it as ANY kind of proof of much of anything... To me is meaningless.
Last edited by Cornelius08; 12-30-2009 at 05:49 PM.
12-30-2009, 05:46 PM
#57
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
There are plenty of trillium and grouse in Greene county. Grouse are on a "down cycle" it seems this past season here, but have seen good numbers several years prior to, and during herd reduction. Trillium? I can take pictures in the spring of hillsides covered with the garbage. Its in no danger of extinction.
Last edited by Cornelius08; 12-30-2009 at 05:55 PM.
12-30-2009, 05:48 PM
#58
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
Times have changed its you that refuse to.
[QUOTE]Why would you ever sell your land?Why would you ever sell your land?[/QUOTE
Mainly , because the land surrounding my property was developed so after the first day the deer retreated to the secure areas and the quality of the hunting dropped dramatically and that was long before the current HR plan. and, BTW, I moved to an area where I had thousands of acres of land open to the public and i didn't have to pay taxes on it.
12-30-2009, 06:01 PM
#59
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
Mainly , because the land surrounding my property was developed so after the first day the deer retreated to the secure areas and the quality of the hunting dropped dramatically and that was long before the current HR plan. and, BTW, I moved to an area where I had thousands of acres of land open to the public and i didn't have to pay taxes on it.
How can todays management plan be so bad yet the plan that ended your private land hunts, pre HR-pre AR have been so successful.
You are sending mixed signals.