Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
03-13-2009, 09:23 AM
#21
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
ORIGINAL: Maverick 1
You didn't do your self any credit with that response. Pretty week. I thought for sure you would be able to do better than that.
You didn't do your self any credit with that response. Pretty week. I thought for sure you would be able to do better than that.
“has maintained a strong [law] enforcement orientation, but has not achieved concurrently strong orientation for professional wildlife biology.”
03-13-2009, 09:34 AM
#22
Banned
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
Not surprising coming from Street. I guess he finally stepped off his decades long anti bowhunter campaign.
Corny, are you aware that thishack has tirelessly campaigned to rescind the last two weeks of bow season since we got it back in the 90's claiming that archers are taking all the good bucks by getting an unfair first crack at them? His latest mantra is that we take all the best bucks out before they can breed.
Corny, are you aware that thishack has tirelessly campaigned to rescind the last two weeks of bow season since we got it back in the 90's claiming that archers are taking all the good bucks by getting an unfair first crack at them? His latest mantra is that we take all the best bucks out before they can breed.
I do see that he had some pretty accurate assessement of the Audubon involvement, and found the Tim Shaeffer dealing to be "underhanded" to say the least. Audubon has been pretty obvious in their attempts to "undercut" us in the wildlife management arena. Alot of this brings into question the validity of any upcoming audit. It should be looked at with a MICROSCOPE by the sportsmen of our state, and not just sucked up and accepted no matter how it is done.
You're sweating the small stuff in regards to your opinions on small details in the article, wether accurate or not. Fact is, enough is accurate beyond doubt, to make one question this "audit" due to heavy audubon involvment, and also yet again call good ol' "Zullinger's" motives into question.
Only thing that was new to me, was the fact audubon had their hand in the "audit" proposal, and naturally want the results to be what THEY desire. Not surprised. On the other hand, Alot of thisare things that many of us already had been following for some time now and knew, yet posting from anothers perspective and perhaps enlightening a few is never a bad thing. Especially when it comes to protecting our hunting heritage in Pa from the #1 enemy we face today. Eco-extremists.
03-13-2009, 09:38 AM
#23
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
He has a regular column in Pa outdoor news and seldom misses the chance to snipe at the "excessive" archery season we enjoy. He has also tended to be one of those crying too few deer when we had FAR FAR too many so the BS detector tends to go off the minute I see his byline
Another take on this whole thing could easily be that Street is starting pre-emptive damage control in anticipation of the audit not producing the desired results he wants.
Another take on this whole thing could easily be that Street is starting pre-emptive damage control in anticipation of the audit not producing the desired results he wants.
03-13-2009, 09:56 AM
#24
Banned
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
You could look at it that way. But if indeed Tim Shaeffer and 'Mel had dealings with legislators and any of that stuff is true, it definately isnt something the sportsmen of our state should turn a blind eye to.
Some things that I have thought odd, were:
1. LEVDANSKY took the initiative???? I thought that VERY bizarre at the time!
2. Noone else was available, andEveland was never even mentioned? and 2B. (LOL) WMI backed off due to the pgc unwillingness to comply because of the lawsuit...So why not go with Eveland now? Why?...Because he wouldnt be going with a proposal that was stamped by audubon.
3.The "ties" of all the players to the same "forest heritage campaign" does NOT look good.
4. I remember well when Zullinger and Shaeffer wrote their letter asking for more time before changes are made...Then proceeded to give THEIR audit proposal? Sorry, but that stinks to high heaven.
5. Anytime AUDUBON is involved in GAME management, I can guarantee its not a GOOD thing, and good things are not about to happen. Mr. Shaeffer gave far more input into our deer plan than ever shouldve occurred, along with the rediculous deermanagement report bythe "deer management team" captained by audubon.
Some things that I have thought odd, were:
1. LEVDANSKY took the initiative???? I thought that VERY bizarre at the time!
2. Noone else was available, andEveland was never even mentioned? and 2B. (LOL) WMI backed off due to the pgc unwillingness to comply because of the lawsuit...So why not go with Eveland now? Why?...Because he wouldnt be going with a proposal that was stamped by audubon.
3.The "ties" of all the players to the same "forest heritage campaign" does NOT look good.
4. I remember well when Zullinger and Shaeffer wrote their letter asking for more time before changes are made...Then proceeded to give THEIR audit proposal? Sorry, but that stinks to high heaven.
5. Anytime AUDUBON is involved in GAME management, I can guarantee its not a GOOD thing, and good things are not about to happen. Mr. Shaeffer gave far more input into our deer plan than ever shouldve occurred, along with the rediculous deermanagement report bythe "deer management team" captained by audubon.
03-13-2009, 10:08 AM
#25
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
You have some fair questions that I'm not totally prepared to answer without looking into it some more.
The fact that Street is way out in left field doesnt totally dismiss all this and I'm willing to take another look but It would be my suggestion that anything he said in that article needs to be triple checked. Thats what I plan to do over thenext few days.
DennyF, whats your take on this whole thing?
The fact that Street is way out in left field doesnt totally dismiss all this and I'm willing to take another look but It would be my suggestion that anything he said in that article needs to be triple checked. Thats what I plan to do over thenext few days.
DennyF, whats your take on this whole thing?
03-13-2009, 12:15 PM
#26
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
While the 77% may have been factually correct at one time, it certainly is not accurate in the CONTEXT you are attempting to use it.
Theres that pesky word context again eh?
Theres that pesky word context again eh?
03-13-2009, 12:33 PM
#27
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
has maintained a strong [law] enforcement orientation, but has not achieved concurrently strong orientation for professional wildlife biology.
That is still an accurate statement and explains why 2F is being managed at almost twice the DD as 2G.
03-13-2009, 01:06 PM
#28
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
ORIGINAL: bluebird2
There is no way I took that data out of it's proper context and you can't provide a single fact to prove otherwise. It is just your personal, opinion that a significant number of archery buck are killed in safety zones or that many are killed during the concurrent season. You try to make the case that a large portion of 2B can't be hunted with fire arms ,but you ignore the fact that it is legal to hunt within a safety zone with written permission from the owner. Also remember homes owned by hunter effectively have no safety zone unless his land is within 150 yds . of another residence.
While the 77% may have been factually correct at one time, it certainly is not accurate in the CONTEXT you are attempting to use it.
Theres that pesky word context again eh?
Theres that pesky word context again eh?
03-13-2009, 01:49 PM
#30
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
RE: Interesting article on Pa Deer Audit
ORIGINAL: bluebird2
Are you sure you can find 2B on a map?
Are you sure you can find 2B on a map?
I done found 2B on a map a coupla times since 2003 but you aint done found a deer to shoot since then. Ya done told us so yisself!
