Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
03-03-2009, 05:41 PM
#51
Typical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 522
RE: Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
So I'm hearing two stories here. One story has a BOC member in a position to benefit from inclusion and the other does not. Which one is true?
You'll likely "hear" lots of stories here. Some folks are alsobig on mountain lions, so the occasional phantom tale about commissioners and PGC employees, always find a willing ear.
All I did was relate what I know about each BOC member. Haven't been able to spot the one that's supposedly in the position to personally profit from xbow inclusion yet.
You'll likely "hear" lots of stories here. Some folks are alsobig on mountain lions, so the occasional phantom tale about commissioners and PGC employees, always find a willing ear.
All I did was relate what I know about each BOC member. Haven't been able to spot the one that's supposedly in the position to personally profit from xbow inclusion yet.
03-03-2009, 05:59 PM
#52
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location:
Posts: 282
RE: Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
ORIGINAL: DennyF
So I'm hearing two stories here. One story has a BOC member in a position to benefit from inclusion and the other does not. Which one is true?
You'll likely "hear" lots of stories here. Some folks are alsobig on mountain lions, so the occasional phantom tale about commissioners and PGC employees, always find a willing ear.
All I did was relate what I know about each BOC member. Haven't been able to spot the one that's supposedly in the position to personally profit from xbow inclusion yet.
So I'm hearing two stories here. One story has a BOC member in a position to benefit from inclusion and the other does not. Which one is true?
You'll likely "hear" lots of stories here. Some folks are alsobig on mountain lions, so the occasional phantom tale about commissioners and PGC employees, always find a willing ear.
All I did was relate what I know about each BOC member. Haven't been able to spot the one that's supposedly in the position to personally profit from xbow inclusion yet.
03-03-2009, 06:32 PM
#53
Fork Horn
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 227
RE: Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
ORIGINAL: BTBowhunter
I too, had read that Schleiden had a shop and sold crossbows. If that is not accurate, I will stand corrected. I did read it and I dont think it was on a forum like this. I beleive it was aprinted source. Dang, now I gotta go look for it.
When it was brought up here, RSB seemed to know what and who we were talking about as he expressed the opinion that the shop was located in a SRA and wouldn't likely see a big growth in xbow sales since they were already in a crossbow legal area.
ORIGINAL: blkpowder
Is it not Schleiden, that has the sports shop?
ORIGINAL: DennyF
What REALLY stinks is that one board member will now reap finacial rewards as a direct result of full inclusion because he owns a shop that sells xbows. He should have recused himself from the whole process.
No BOC member that I'm aware of, who will profit from the inclusion of xbows in archery seasons. Neitheroutgoing commissionerSchleiden nor Palonewill benefit. Boop is an attorney; Schreffler is a retired educator, farmer, etc; Delaney is a professional fireman/EMT; Weaner is a school teacher.
Some on other boards have insisted Isabella will, because "he owns a gunshop". Isabella doesn't own a "gunshop". He's a partner in a business whose primary focus is in sellingPolice equipment and related firearms.
What REALLY stinks is that one board member will now reap finacial rewards as a direct result of full inclusion because he owns a shop that sells xbows. He should have recused himself from the whole process.
No BOC member that I'm aware of, who will profit from the inclusion of xbows in archery seasons. Neitheroutgoing commissionerSchleiden nor Palonewill benefit. Boop is an attorney; Schreffler is a retired educator, farmer, etc; Delaney is a professional fireman/EMT; Weaner is a school teacher.
Some on other boards have insisted Isabella will, because "he owns a gunshop". Isabella doesn't own a "gunshop". He's a partner in a business whose primary focus is in sellingPolice equipment and related firearms.
When it was brought up here, RSB seemed to know what and who we were talking about as he expressed the opinion that the shop was located in a SRA and wouldn't likely see a big growth in xbow sales since they were already in a crossbow legal area.
I don't want tosee your busted, busted, so I won't commit to any names.
03-04-2009, 05:31 AM
#54
Giant Nontypical
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
RE: Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
I just seems science is used to promote a program when it supplies catalysis for program that results in achieving their predetermined goal.Yet when science can be used to justify the altering ofa program they are ignored.
The ongoing wood rat study should bring about some eye opening conclusions to the hows and whys of every day living in the moderntimes, wood rats life.[:-]
The ongoing wood rat study should bring about some eye opening conclusions to the hows and whys of every day living in the moderntimes, wood rats life.[:-]
03-04-2009, 08:46 AM
#56
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Dover, PA USA
Posts: 5,497
RE: Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
ORIGINAL: the outsider
This kinda brings me back to my questions regarding inclusion and gaining a better understanding about the process and decision making.How many hunters expressed their views (for and against) to the BOC? 100? 1,000? 10,000?
ORIGINAL: DennyF
So I'm hearing two stories here. One story has a BOC member in a position to benefit from inclusion and the other does not. Which one is true?
You'll likely "hear" lots of stories here. Some folks are alsobig on mountain lions, so the occasional phantom tale about commissioners and PGC employees, always find a willing ear.
All I did was relate what I know about each BOC member. Haven't been able to spot the one that's supposedly in the position to personally profit from xbow inclusion yet.
So I'm hearing two stories here. One story has a BOC member in a position to benefit from inclusion and the other does not. Which one is true?
You'll likely "hear" lots of stories here. Some folks are alsobig on mountain lions, so the occasional phantom tale about commissioners and PGC employees, always find a willing ear.
All I did was relate what I know about each BOC member. Haven't been able to spot the one that's supposedly in the position to personally profit from xbow inclusion yet.
Commissioner Weaner:
My vote on the crossbow issue will be no:
Felt overwhelmingly hunters were opposed to them.
Felt it was foolish to upset the majority of PA hunters.
He felt there would not be the big recruitment as many proclaimed.
Just saw no up side for inclusion.
Commissioner Boop:
I intend to vote no.
Stated that for two years he was the President of the BOC. In that position he controlled the dissemination of information to the BOC. In that time he never saw crossbows on the radar.
In June of last year one commissioner suggested we look at it. Seven months later here we are on a final vote to approve it.
The BOC has always moved slow. Slow and methodical on bear archery, deer management, and other seasons and initiatives (he had a long list).
Why the rush on this??
He stated, every commissioner got 500 to a 1000 emails and letters on this issue. The urban areas more on the high side. In his emails, it went 90/10. 90% opposed inclusion. He was hearing the same from other commissioners.
He agreed with Commissioner Weaner, that the BOC was going to annoy hunters and harm the six week archery season.
He suggested that it was legislative interference and threats driving this vote. Mentioned that regardless of the vote by the BOC, members of the legislature have indicated they would introduce bills to stop inclusion, or mandate inclusion. Legislative interference is the last thing we (hunters) need.
Suggested options for, and types of info needed to be studied. Stated that if this is such a good proposal now, it will still be a good proposal in 2010. Lets do due diligence on this and not rush.
He noted that the BOC is changing. There will be three new commissioners on board by next year. They will need to deal with the fallout of this decision. Doesn't seem fair.
Vote this down, or table it and do the due diligence.
Commissioner Boop then made a formal amendment proposal to table the agenda item.
Amendment failed 3-4
Yeahs: Boop, Weaner, Delaney
03-04-2009, 12:20 PM
#57
Typical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 522
RE: Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
9 to 1 opposed to xbow inclusion is the figure I heard.
But I also was told by one Commissioner that this "ratio" had quickly started to level off, once the NRA issued their 2 Cents worth on the subject and started sending out emails for xbowinclusion in PA.
This is why many archers who are also NRA Life members,are now PO'd at the NRA for sticking its nose into this tussle. I'm a life member of the NRA and have volunteered on their behalf here in PAquite often, especially over the past 16 years.
Other thanthe "straw grab"put forth that xbow inclusion will somehow magically cause more people to buy a PAhunting license, I'm at a loss to explain to anyonewhy the NRA would jump into this one at the last minute.
But I also was told by one Commissioner that this "ratio" had quickly started to level off, once the NRA issued their 2 Cents worth on the subject and started sending out emails for xbowinclusion in PA.
This is why many archers who are also NRA Life members,are now PO'd at the NRA for sticking its nose into this tussle. I'm a life member of the NRA and have volunteered on their behalf here in PAquite often, especially over the past 16 years.
Other thanthe "straw grab"put forth that xbow inclusion will somehow magically cause more people to buy a PAhunting license, I'm at a loss to explain to anyonewhy the NRA would jump into this one at the last minute.
03-04-2009, 12:28 PM
#58
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
RE: Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
I just seems science is used to promote a program when it supplies catalysis for program that results in achieving their predetermined goal.Yet when science can be used to justify the altering of a program they are ignored.
03-04-2009, 03:28 PM
#60
Typical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: 2G Gaines Pa
Posts: 524
RE: Is the P.G.C. in suicide mode?
Today is National Good Grammar Day, I just finished up putting 20 dozen 1.5mm beads on 20 dozen #18 hooks, and to top it off I just heard a report that Merrill Lynch gave their top 11 execs bonuses last year that totalled $200 million. The final straw was when I found out this afternoon that my $12 a bag roll-your-own smoking tobacco will cost me $25 starting April first.
I better refrain from comment on the PGCs BOCs until a later date.
I better refrain from comment on the PGCs BOCs until a later date.