What to do with the crossbows.
02-05-2009, 07:55 PM
#71
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SW PA USA
Posts: 7,220
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
You can Bluebird the facts as many ways as you like but the bottom line is that PA is providing more for less than every adjoining state and doing so without any outside money.
I was in favor of an increase before but after doing a little research, I'm surprised that they aren't asking for more.
I was in favor of an increase before but after doing a little research, I'm surprised that they aren't asking for more.
02-06-2009, 06:43 AM
#72
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA.
Posts: 5,195
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
ORIGINAL: R.S.B.
There is another major difference between those states you are comparing to Pennsylvania that everyone needs to take into consideration too.
I haven’t it looking for each of those states to be sure if they are all general fund states but I know most of them are. That means that since all of the tax payers in those states pay for wildlife management with money being allocated from the state budget their wildlife agency doesn’t have to rely on only the hunting license dollars.
If Pennsylvania were a general fund agency wildlife management being funded with more then just hunting license money maybe the cost of a hunting license wouldn’t need to increase as much or as often.
The bottom line is that the money to run each state’s wildlife programs has to come form somewhere. Hunter’s in this state have to date wanted to be the sole source of wildlife management funding and they are with the exception of the slight revenue from timber, minerals or restricted use federal funds so it will either cost them more or they will simply end up with less in wildlife management then states that are better funded with tax dollars.
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
ORIGINAL: Cornelius08
REsident hunting licenses compared.
West Virginia----------------$23.00
Georgia---------------------$19.00
Florida----------------------$17.00
Illinois-----------------------$13.00
New York--------------------$19.00
Pa---------------------------$20.00
Btb wants to point out that pa includes ringneck and turkey. Thats nice but most are DEER hunters. Second, it all evens out because some of the other states offer other things as well. Some have furbearers included (pa needs added stamp) some include feral hogs (which pa doesnt even have) others include both bow and muzzleloader within that fee...
Underpaying? Hardly. We are about average, and could be argued GROSSLY overpaying due to lack of management which we are paying for.
With the rediculously high increase, we'll be paying top dollar for the samemismanagement we are paying for now.
REsident hunting licenses compared.
West Virginia----------------$23.00
Georgia---------------------$19.00
Florida----------------------$17.00
Illinois-----------------------$13.00
New York--------------------$19.00
Pa---------------------------$20.00
Btb wants to point out that pa includes ringneck and turkey. Thats nice but most are DEER hunters. Second, it all evens out because some of the other states offer other things as well. Some have furbearers included (pa needs added stamp) some include feral hogs (which pa doesnt even have) others include both bow and muzzleloader within that fee...
Underpaying? Hardly. We are about average, and could be argued GROSSLY overpaying due to lack of management which we are paying for.
With the rediculously high increase, we'll be paying top dollar for the samemismanagement we are paying for now.
There is another major difference between those states you are comparing to Pennsylvania that everyone needs to take into consideration too.
I haven’t it looking for each of those states to be sure if they are all general fund states but I know most of them are. That means that since all of the tax payers in those states pay for wildlife management with money being allocated from the state budget their wildlife agency doesn’t have to rely on only the hunting license dollars.
If Pennsylvania were a general fund agency wildlife management being funded with more then just hunting license money maybe the cost of a hunting license wouldn’t need to increase as much or as often.
The bottom line is that the money to run each state’s wildlife programs has to come form somewhere. Hunter’s in this state have to date wanted to be the sole source of wildlife management funding and they are with the exception of the slight revenue from timber, minerals or restricted use federal funds so it will either cost them more or they will simply end up with less in wildlife management then states that are better funded with tax dollars.
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
rsb,what needs to be done is every employee of PGC wages and title have to be examined.
where i worked, if our business went down, layoffs and consolidation had to happen.
was this good, yes and no.
do to lack of game in pa ,i think the PGC needs to reduce its size .i am saying this without knowing WAGES or POSITIONS in game commission.
only area i feel should be out limits is WCO AND LAND MANAGEMENT AREAS.
all programs should be looked at and DEER should be no.1 priority because thats area that brings in most money for PGC.
without good deer hunting, hunters numbers will continue to drop unless they make it deer hunting from oct to feb with any gun,i see that happening someday soon too.
butthat will reduce deer to nothing and how that affects hunter numberseven if they can hunt 5 months with rifle.
if bats are in trouble, let bat groups payPGC wages, not hunters.
same with birds, let the bird groups pay wages of the bird PGC .
same with deer hunters, let deer hunters pay for deer ,NOT FOR EVERYTHING ELSE.
i know PGC is obligated to take care of everything, bats, bugs, snakes but no longer can the hunters keep funding all these things with their dollars.
there was 10,000 hikers using woods last summer in a megastarnt thing at hyner, pa.
i was there.
not 1 of them bought a hunting license,yet theylove seeing birds and bats etc.deer too.
these people should be made to buy a PGC permit,say for 10 dollars to be able to go into woods and enjoy it.
also i bet you would double your volunteers if this was done.
i thing i see about these people is they have money and they do GET INVOLVED in woods etc.
there is 1 idea. other is smaller vehicles and more employees doubling up to ride to meeting and others should use their own vehicle.
positions should be check and i bet i could get rid of many and make more positions as WCO and LAND MANAGEMENT.
i would just like to see overtime that is spent.
we done away with overtime and made all of us SALARY.
we got more money but were on call 24/7.
also we were allowed to set our own hrs.
i would come in 1 day 8 am to 5,next 2 am to 7am,back out at 5 pm to 11pm.
if i had meeting, like at 10 am, i would come in and work 7 am to 4 pm.
this would be a big help on POACHING, no longer would you have to get permission on like said too me, SPROUL I ONLY HAVE 3 HRS LEFT TO CATCHJOE THE POACHER THIS MONTH.
trust me, being on salary was real nice for us, we made more than avg weekly wage as before and NO BOSSES to tell us when to come out or ok the overtime.
02-06-2009, 07:27 AM
#73
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
You can Bluebird the facts as many ways as you like but the bottom line is that PA is providing more for less than every adjoining state and doing so without any outside money.
Pas deer hunting is a joke. The management is a bigger joke. The price is average, And the price will be among the highest in the country when the fee increase takes place.
Its also more than clear that you are part of the damage control effort, and have some "unhealthy" ties to one of the antideer factions...be it the enviromentalists or pgc themselves.
Noone else would make such asnine inaccurate summary of hunting in Pa on a regular basis regarding just about everything.[:'(] You should spend more time on hpa. Youd fit right in there.
02-06-2009, 08:20 AM
#74
Fork Horn
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 297
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
ORIGINAL: R.S.B.
The bottom line is that the money to run each state’s wildlife programs has to come form somewhere. Hunter’s in this state have to date wanted to be the sole source of wildlife management funding and they are with the exception of the slight revenue from timber, minerals or restricted use federal funds so it will either cost them more or they will simply end up with less in wildlife management then states that are better funded with tax dollars.
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
The bottom line is that the money to run each state’s wildlife programs has to come form somewhere. Hunter’s in this state have to date wanted to be the sole source of wildlife management funding and they are with the exception of the slight revenue from timber, minerals or restricted use federal funds so it will either cost them more or they will simply end up with less in wildlife management then states that are better funded with tax dollars.
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
We already know what your pathetic opinion is of hunters. We also know how you would like to see the commission held less acountable to hunters. That is what is in your heart. It has nothing to do with the cost of a hunting license.
02-06-2009, 06:23 PM
#75
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location:
Posts: 282
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
What does this mean? Do we, as hunters have some control overwhere the funds come from?
R.S. Bodenhorn
What does this mean? Do we, as hunters have some control overwhere the funds come from?
02-06-2009, 06:27 PM
#76
Typical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 584
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
ORIGINAL: Maverick 1
D i c k,
We already know what your pathetic opinion is of hunters. We also know how you would like to see the commission held less acountable to hunters. That is what is in your heart. It has nothing to do with the cost of a hunting license.
ORIGINAL: R.S.B.
The bottom line is that the money to run each state’s wildlife programs has to come form somewhere. Hunter’s in this state have to date wanted to be the sole source of wildlife management funding and they are with the exception of the slight revenue from timber, minerals or restricted use federal funds so it will either cost them more or they will simply end up with less in wildlife management then states that are better funded with tax dollars.
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
The bottom line is that the money to run each state’s wildlife programs has to come form somewhere. Hunter’s in this state have to date wanted to be the sole source of wildlife management funding and they are with the exception of the slight revenue from timber, minerals or restricted use federal funds so it will either cost them more or they will simply end up with less in wildlife management then states that are better funded with tax dollars.
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
We already know what your pathetic opinion is of hunters. We also know how you would like to see the commission held less acountable to hunters. That is what is in your heart. It has nothing to do with the cost of a hunting license.
What is really obvious is that you know far less about what I want or stand for then you think you do.
I have spent a lifetime standing up for the best possible management or our resources and for the betterment of hunting and the hunter while people like you have done your best to destroy all of those things.
It is really quite simple, if hunters aren’t willing or even demanding that they adequately fund wildlife management then any RESPONSIBLE person that cares about the future of wildlife and hunting has to look for other methods of funding wildlife management. If you aren’t smart enough to figure that out that I don’t figure you as much of a benefit to the future of hunting or wildlife and nothing more then part of the problem.
R.S. Bodenhorn
02-06-2009, 06:30 PM
#77
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 169
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
ORIGINAL: the outsider
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
What does this mean? Do we, as hunters have some control overwhere the funds come from?
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
What does this mean? Do we, as hunters have some control overwhere the funds come from?
02-06-2009, 06:32 PM
#78
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
"What is really obvious is that you know far less about what I want or stand for then you think you do. "
Ive posted on boards with you for over 7 years. Id say he hit the nail squarely on the head. You have extremeist views. You are no friend of the hunter.
Ive posted on boards with you for over 7 years. Id say he hit the nail squarely on the head. You have extremeist views. You are no friend of the hunter.
02-06-2009, 06:34 PM
#79
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location:
Posts: 2,978
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
We have limited say in funding pgc. Id suggest all who are wanting to rid pgc of the ecoweiner influence, contact our legislators by email or letter and let them know what is occurring is unacceptable and to tell pgc NO to a license fee increase until change is made. That is the reason why pgc hasnt yet recieved the fee increase. Huge numbers of hunters contacting their legislators.
02-06-2009, 06:38 PM
#80
Fork Horn
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location:
Posts: 282
RE: What to do with the crossbows.
ORIGINAL: explorer_Jack
Yes, Tax payers have a big say so in this. It is their money and if they want re-elected they better listen to the tax payers. Besides that.Isn't there a little box you check if you want to donate a dollar to wildlife on the income tax return? That should tell you if the PA residents wants to fund the wild life program.
ORIGINAL: the outsider
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
What does this mean? Do we, as hunters have some control overwhere the funds come from?
In those general fund states the license fees just help augment the tax dollars being used for wildlife management. But, hey hunters in this state are afraid of that type of funding. I guess Pennsylvania hunters don’t trust their politicians enough to allow tax dollars being used in wildlife management like occurs in all those other states.
R.S. Bodenhorn
What does this mean? Do we, as hunters have some control overwhere the funds come from?