DougE

Confused,I appologize because you post was well thought out.Unforunately,right off the back several people have to start complaining about no deer and making false accusations that border on slander.Once again,I have to add that they have no facts to back up their riduiculous assertations.That's where the problems start.People with misguided and uneducated opinions start brewing up conspiracy theories and making false acusation.I'm still waiting for anything that resembles a shred of proof concerning anyone at the PGC or the volunteer commissioners benefitting monetarily from a reduced deer herd.It's friggin ridiculous.

cornelius,according to the 2006 annual report,2S had 40 preseason dpsm(yeah that's really something to complain about)while 2B had 36 dpsm and 5c had 32 dpsm.

We still have guys complaining that they aren't seing 30 deer a day anymore.It simply boggles my mind that people actually don't see anything wrong with those numbers.

Cornelius08

"Confused,I appologize because you post was well thought out.Unforunately,right off the back several people have to start complaining about no deer and making false accusations that border on slander."

I see no denial.

"Once again,I have to add that they have no facts to back up their riduiculous assertations."

The facts have been posted to YOU on several boards including this one SEVERAL times each, and you are well aware. Need I attach a permanent attachment to every post to prevent your decietful "playing dumb"?

"That's where the problems start.People with misguided and uneducated opinions start brewing up conspiracy theories and making false acusation.I'm still waiting for anything that resembles a shred of proof concerning anyone at the PGC or the volunteer commissioners benefitting monetarily from a reduced deer herd.It's friggin ridiculous."

As are your posts. Iexplained pgc'smotivations and anyone close to the issue pretty muchknows it. Many of us state it matter of factly, others will deny the truth tothe end. Well guess what douge. The end is near. How muchlonger will PGc hold out without cash without making change?Or will they go broke? Neither here nor there to me. Might be better if thefrauds get tossed. If they do change things upto get license increase, they'll be back to no good and "staying the course" immediately after anyways. Time to clean house. 3 commissioner chairs to fill.Ifntheres a shred of justice left in this state, they'll be replaced with prohunting commissioners and not the likes of those treehuggers.

"cornelius,according to the 2006 annual report,2S had 40 preseason dpsm(yeah that's really something to complain about)while 2B had 36 dpsm and 5c had 32 dpsm."

Yeah doug. It went up. ha ha ha. 10,000 more tags thanalong with the smaller herdwhen 10,000 less actuallyactually reduced thethen largerherd approx 7%..and now all of the sudden the herd ROSE. Brilliant! (LOL) Then since 06throw in the ehd and even HIGHER tag numbers during the 2007 season.... .[:'(]

"We still have guys complaining that they aren't seing 30 deer a day anymore."

Ha ha ha. Try 3 to 7.. On a good day. Ha ha 30. Your a funny guy. Youve also highlighted my statement about your "other" agenda. By doing exactly what Id accused you of doing..YET AGAIN. I stated Pgc manages the herd (supposedly[8D]) on herd health, habitat and human conflict. Based on those things there is no reason for the herd to be further decreased in the wmu and pgc even says the goal is STABILIZATION not DECREASE..and in that context it doesnt matter if the herd dd is 9 or 90.. Goal is NOT to decrease, yet the allocation says otherwise as Ive shown you, is not debatable...Time and again, yet you try to dodge the issue. Why is that? Forget wether I have a right to be "upset" or not in your opinion. I pointed out a pgc flat out lie. Proving they CANNOT be trusted at the very least. And very well points to their "other" agendas. Agendas which I know beyond doubt you are well aware of, and apparently support. They are still trying to lower the herd in areas of claimed stabilization without claiming to do so because they simply cannot scientifically justify it up front. But less deer = less deer for the ecofruitcakes who they are currently tighter than two coats of paint with.

DougE

You or nobody else has never posted one fact showing that anyone from the PGC has ever taken a bribe or was benefitting financially in any way from herd reductions.To insinuate so is slander.No facts have ever been posted on any message board.

please enligten me about my other agenda.

It's funny.Not long ago you boasted about being able to kill 100's of doe if you wanted to now.Now you're only seeing a handful of deer a day in the WMU that has the highest deer densities in the entire state.Ah,I feel bad for you.

Cornelius08

"You or nobody else has never posted one fact showing that anyone from the PGC has ever taken a bribe or was benefitting financially in any way from herd reductions.To insinuate so is slander.No facts have ever been posted on any message board."

In case you missed it, which Im certain you did, as you seem to miss EVERYTHING of consequence. I didnt say they have taken bribes or benefitted in any way financially so why would I try to prove something that isnt my position? I said they are doing this because the boc have other agendas because of their affiliates and cohorts. Nothing more. Nothing less. The only time I mentioned money was in regards to the money they arent getting because of their irresponsible actions..a license fee increase.

"please enligten me about my other agenda."

God only knows. Its more thanapparent you have one. Iveread your stuff and traded posts with you for a long time now on severalboards. Dontexpect you to own up and dont really care. If ya wanna come clean fine, ifnot, fine too.

"It's funny.Not long ago you boasted about being able to kill 100's of doe if you wanted to now.Now you're only seeing a handful of deer a day in the WMU that has the highest deer densities in the entire state.Ah,I feel bad for you."

1. I bow hunt only.
2. It is what it is. Thats the general numbermost are seeing. Some days slightly more others none at all.
3. Highest deer density is debatable. In fact its a lie.
4. Dont feel bad for me.I could still kill 100's if I want. But that wouldnt be legal and I have no reason to rifle hunt. I can hunt enoughdays and find them if necessary. Killing does isnt exactlybrain surgery. I also dont shoot does. Pgc has made that a not so smart thing to do these days. I shoot "better" than minimum requirement (4 pts side bucks) and havent exactly suffered greatly in my success. That still has zero to do with pgcs sham deer plan, how its effecting our sport and the fact its completely irresponsible to cater to ecofools when our wildlife management is suffering because pgc is going broke almost as if they want to!

And btw....You STILL avoided the realissue I posed. Proven pgc lies. Yet you chose to insult and post known nonsense instead of addressing but instead conveniently overlooked for the third or fourth time straight.

BTBowhunter

I, for one, aint buying it Cornelius. One only needs to put on some road miles in 2A to know that the deer densities are still very high there. Roadkills everywhere and dozens of deer visible from the highway every single time I go through 2A.

You may have trouble finding deer in 2A but I don't know anyone else who does.

Cornelius08

You read about as well as Doug. The point was pgc are liars and I proved why. I dont care if you think there are enough deer here, not enough or too many. Pgc said we were just right for our area 4 years earlier when ever since they claimed our herd should be stabilized. It isnt being and we are just as far below cc as some of the much lower areas.

Yourlying about the roadkills. I travel the entire length of the wmu at least 3 times a week. Rts. 21 and 79. If your counting dozens in a day dead, then your drunk and seeing triple or quadrupleits that simple. For your information, Id suggest you read the annual reports. Human conflict for unit 2A was rated as low. That wasnt my opinion, it was Pgcs'. Not saying there are more deer here than many areas(and of course there is no reason not to be). Point is. Pgc is draining us too, despite claims of stabilization. And thats a lie. And a bunch of crap.And Ive shown the allocation comparisons that show it quite clearly.

Cornelius08

"You may have trouble finding deer in 2A but I don't know anyone else who does"

You probably know noone and if so someone who hunts highly off limits land. I also dont have trouble finding deer even though I hunt nonposted private and public land also. i dont rate pgcs performance on wether I can find a deer or not. Pretty petty crap, your view of that if that is indeed your view.

I live here. I hunt here. I know dozens of others that do. None of them are particularly happy with the gameless commission these days. And these guys arent unskilled jokers like ya'all. Many of the better hunters, self included when speaking of effect to us personally, the main gripe is the lessened number of good bucks due to less being born and more bb being killed. We have no effect from ar, since the number saved doesnt equal the number of bb not being born and those that were killed as bb for years now thanks to far too many tags.

No reason for us to go to "big-woods" deer levels (even pgc supports that contention by word if not by action). but that is exactly where we are headed thanks to blanket unwarranted reductions.

BTBowhunter

I didn't say dozens dead. read it again. I said roadkills everywhere and dozens visible from the roads.

I guess it simply boils down to the fact that some of us can find the deer and some can't. I can understand how those that cant find em would have a tough time accepting that some of us can.

Cornelius08

"I didn't say dozens dead. read it again. I said roadkills everywhere and dozens visible from the roads. "

Then the assumption of roadkills "everywhere" isstill mistaken. What are you judging it by? North central Pa single deer density standards? (LOL) Orby the same area 20 years ago? Lets keep things in context ok? Yeah right...And as for dozens visible, is there a problem with that? Lots of fields and openings. Some of what makes our wmu good habitat. We dont have miles upon miles of mature timber. If they are in a field you see them. IF you go by many miles preseason in evening or at night anddont see deer, then youve got a severe problem here...like is the case in some of the ehd worst hit areas.

"I guess it simply boils down to the fact that some of us can find the deer and some can't.I can understand how those that cant find em would have a tough time accepting that some of us can."

And some of us try crazily to act as if they are better hunters than others who have forgotten more than they will everknow.(LOL) in an attempt to cover the fact that "not so flattering" facts and lies have been proven.

BTBowhunter

By simple comparison to sightings in 2B and 2D where I also travel through a lot. I generally see plenty in 2B and 2D and usually see more in 2A

Context OK with you now?