Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
12-29-2008, 11:30 AM
#41
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: PA
Posts: 1,149
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
ORIGINAL: DougE
Easy BT.The habitat was so degraded in 2G,that it took very few deer to continue impacting it.Many places,especially 2g needed alot less deer than the MSY.You have shown nothing to prove that the forest certification had anything to do with statewide herd reductions.Once again,thecertified forests are such a small percentage of Pa that they had no impact on the total plan.You need to get off your back 40 and seeexactly how much impact the deer had in many vast areas of 2G.the state forests are being managed at a much lower dd than the game lands which proves that forest certification had nothing to do with staewide herd reduction.
Rich,there's no doubt that the public land near urban areas have probably taken a beating.Where do those deer go when the shooting starts?
Easy BT.The habitat was so degraded in 2G,that it took very few deer to continue impacting it.Many places,especially 2g needed alot less deer than the MSY.You have shown nothing to prove that the forest certification had anything to do with statewide herd reductions.Once again,thecertified forests are such a small percentage of Pa that they had no impact on the total plan.You need to get off your back 40 and seeexactly how much impact the deer had in many vast areas of 2G.the state forests are being managed at a much lower dd than the game lands which proves that forest certification had nothing to do with staewide herd reduction.
Rich,there's no doubt that the public land near urban areas have probably taken a beating.Where do those deer go when the shooting starts?
IN people's freezers.
Places like perry county in the tusc state forest has little private land within.A few places on the outer edges might have posted land but that depends on how much the landowners nail them.The populations got so low in one section of the tusc state forest they took it out of demap.You know the numbers gotta be low for the dcnr to make that move.
We hunted grouse there a few years back in the second season.Loads of acorns still on the ground yet very little if any deer sign.Some guy told me the acorns weren't getting eaten cause worms were in the acorns.I said yeah right.There weren't any deer that's why.
Maybe since the area was taken out of dmap the herd increased alittle.Can't say I wouldn't go anywhere near that place for deer.
12-29-2008, 11:32 AM
#42
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: PA
Posts: 1,149
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
ORIGINAL: bawanajim
If you were to look into the failure of generation for generations its clear to see that through generations of lack of regeneration the outlook for future generations to generate has been greatly reduced,generally speaking.
If you were to look into the failure of generation for generations its clear to see that through generations of lack of regeneration the outlook for future generations to generate has been greatly reduced,generally speaking.
Either you need a writing class or I need a reading comprehension class.Maybe spelling too.
12-29-2008, 11:42 AM
#43
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,262
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
Rich,DCNRhas taken several areas out of dmap.They won't do it however,until they have some timber sales without the ned to fence.
I find alot of uneaten acorns each year that have grubs in them.Not unusual at all.My buddy hung a stand near a red oak three years ago that was loaded.He couldn't believe not onedeer came in to feed on the thousands that were laying on the ground.I don't know why,but they were all hollow inside.Weird
BT,none of what you stated means a thing.The fact is,the state forests have many more tags and a longer season.That proves without a doubt that they're being managed at a lower dd than the rest of the state.How can you even argue with that?
I find alot of uneaten acorns each year that have grubs in them.Not unusual at all.My buddy hung a stand near a red oak three years ago that was loaded.He couldn't believe not onedeer came in to feed on the thousands that were laying on the ground.I don't know why,but they were all hollow inside.Weird
BT,none of what you stated means a thing.The fact is,the state forests have many more tags and a longer season.That proves without a doubt that they're being managed at a lower dd than the rest of the state.How can you even argue with that?
12-29-2008, 11:44 AM
#44
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
ORIGINAL: germain
Either you need a writing class or I need a reading comprehension class.Maybe spelling too.
ORIGINAL: bawanajim
If you were to look into the failure of generation for generations its clear to see that through generations of lack of regeneration the outlook for future generations to generate has been greatly reduced,generally speaking.
If you were to look into the failure of generation for generations its clear to see that through generations of lack of regeneration the outlook for future generations to generate has been greatly reduced,generally speaking.
Either you need a writing class or I need a reading comprehension class.Maybe spelling too.
12-29-2008, 12:14 PM
#45
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,879
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
BT,none of what you stated means a thing.The fact is,the state forests have many more tags and a longer season.That proves without a doubt that they're being managed at a lower dd than the rest of the state.How can you even argue with that?
12-29-2008, 12:19 PM
#46
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
ORIGINAL: bluebird2
The point is that without massive herd reduction on SGLs and adjoining private lands, the harvests due to DMAP on DCNR land would be insignificant and the herds would actually increase. That is why DCNR blackmailed the PGC into statewide HR.
BT,none of what you stated means a thing.The fact is,the state forests have many more tags and a longer season.That proves without a doubt that they're being managed at a lower dd than the rest of the state.How can you even argue with that?
12-29-2008, 12:33 PM
#47
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Join Date: Sep 2008
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Posts: 2,978
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
Jim, no conspiracy there. Thats a fact. Was it THEE SOLE reason we implemented severe reduction? Thats debatable. But I'll guarantee you it was one of the high priority considerations, and was seen by far as more of a priotity than hunting in this state ever will be by the powers that be.
Remember Dcnr must rubber stamp the commissioners in the selection process. Its also undeniable that forest certification is HUGE to them. You don't think dcnr could be VERY instrumental in getting the appropriate people into place to fulfill their own agenda? And better question... Wouldnt they be complete idiots if they did not?? Thats one of the reasons why the current commissioner selection process stinks.
Remember Dcnr must rubber stamp the commissioners in the selection process. Its also undeniable that forest certification is HUGE to them. You don't think dcnr could be VERY instrumental in getting the appropriate people into place to fulfill their own agenda? And better question... Wouldnt they be complete idiots if they did not?? Thats one of the reasons why the current commissioner selection process stinks.
12-29-2008, 12:51 PM
#48
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 8,167
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
Then now is the time to try and change the plan, write letters to your state rep. Go to meetings ,dress well ,speak clearly and try to change things.
The power is with the people this is still America.
The power is with the people this is still America.
12-29-2008, 12:52 PM
#49
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 2,262
RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
Nope,it's not debatable.DCNR asked for longer seasons,unlimited dmaps per person,the ability to transfer those tags,group hunting,baiting and rifles in all seasons.they got none of that.They got dmap and the ability to use those tags throughout rifle season.The PGC did not cavein on any of those other requests.
Common and show us where DCNR has final say to rubber stamp the choice for commissioner.They are part of the process but they don't rubber stamp anyone.
Common and show us where DCNR has final say to rubber stamp the choice for commissioner.They are part of the process but they don't rubber stamp anyone.
12-29-2008, 01:10 PM
#50
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Join Date: Sep 2008
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RE: Do you agree with extent of Herd Reduction in Pa?
"Nope,it's not debatable.DCNR asked for longer seasons,unlimited dmaps per person,the ability to transfer those tags,group hunting,baiting and rifles in all seasons.they got none of that."
Only reason I said debatable is not because they werent a major player and at least partially to blame, it was because there are also other players in the nonsense. Anyway as for dcnr, They asked for rediculous over the toptools publicly so they could get exactly what they wanted without appearing to. Theywanted one thing and one only. Reduction to the deer herd.They recieved the tools to initiate extreme and excessive reduction which is exactly what they got.
"Common and show us where DCNR has final say to rubber stamp the choice for commissioner."
I didnt say final say. Maybe YOU can show where I said that? Thought not.[:'(] HERE is what I said "Remember Dcnr must rubber stamp the commissioners in the selection process". And that is a fact. If they dont recieve the rubberstamp, they are FINISHED. They interview and they ELIMINATE any and all candidates that they do not want and thats a fact...and you know this, would rather decietfully play on words than discuss the facts.
Only reason I said debatable is not because they werent a major player and at least partially to blame, it was because there are also other players in the nonsense. Anyway as for dcnr, They asked for rediculous over the toptools publicly so they could get exactly what they wanted without appearing to. Theywanted one thing and one only. Reduction to the deer herd.They recieved the tools to initiate extreme and excessive reduction which is exactly what they got.
"Common and show us where DCNR has final say to rubber stamp the choice for commissioner."
I didnt say final say. Maybe YOU can show where I said that? Thought not.[:'(] HERE is what I said "Remember Dcnr must rubber stamp the commissioners in the selection process". And that is a fact. If they dont recieve the rubberstamp, they are FINISHED. They interview and they ELIMINATE any and all candidates that they do not want and thats a fact...and you know this, would rather decietfully play on words than discuss the facts.