eerdog

I agree with you to a point. No offense taken, just good discussion. I agree with you to the point that the free ride is over. The part I don't agree with you on is hunting is a good family and young person education on disipline, respect and love of mother nature. The fact that we are selling every farm, every large forest land acreage to be divided up into sublots is putting you to the point of getting $1000+ for hunting leases. That is the part that is the free ride is over. We are selling our productive lands of produce, forest land, wildlife to the over population of this county, in return putting our dinner tables to those that are our enemies unless we are giving them money. Now in another point is that we are commercializing hunting to the point that it is all about the killing of the big buck and spending many thousand dollars each year on guns, ammo, camo, stands, leases, ATVs all for about 30-40 pounds of meat if you are lucky in a season. So, I agree with you it is a good business move, I disagree with the back lining to you statement that the free ride is over.

I thought your post said that the 60 acres was in Mon County. I understand your lawyer comments, but that is the legal system. You are not free from anything regardless how much insurance, signs, gates, whatever. If someone wants to put in court they will. My point should have been consider and know who you lease the property to, have a lease agreement stating liablities and then use your property insurance as back up. If a judge wants to rule you neglence then he would have to go through the lease agreement, and your property insurance first. At that point then you would have to been seriously at fault that you have caused an injury or death, or damages. Again just my opinion on it and didn't go to law school, so that opinion isn't worth much. But if the property was in Webster County then you do have a good piece of property for hunting lease and would feel better about your price.

What was your point on the timber company? Was that the company you bought it from?

eerdog

Oh I got you now on the burgoo stuff. That would likely be Plum Creek Timber Company and if it is 200 members you are probably talking not the whole acreage unless they have went ahead and leased it all. Now that isn't really much of sharing.. I am not sure the exact acreage per member is, I want to say 100, but maybe 50 acres per member they allow. But the way the hunting clubs work is members have their own area they hunt and stands etc. So, there isn't any running over top of people. The Plum Creek tract there is 25,000 acres, but there is other timber companies in that area as well that it could be.

fellas2

I guess I need to throw my two cents in. eerdog, you say the "free ride is over" ! Why ? Why is it that we have become so greedy that we now have to charge some one to hunt deer that technically don't even belong to them ? Why has it now become fashinable to pay $1,000,$2,000, or even $3,000 to kill a deer.It's gotten way out of hand as far as i'm concerned.I recently lost my place to hunt in Greene County and have been reduced to looking for some place to "pay" to hunt,but let me tell you,people are nut's for what they want.I had a guy call me yesterday with 700 acres in Albion just south of Erie with 700 acres he's considering leasing,but wants a minimum of $20.00 per acre. I'm sorry,but anyone who pays $14,000.00 to hunt deer needs some psyciatric help,especially for a piece of property that is a completely unknow commodity.I can see a guy wanting a couple of dollars an acres to cover taxes,etc but I don't want to make anybody rich in the process.Seems to me we're watching way too many hunting programs on tv and have lost sight of the real expectations of hunting in this state or hunting in general.It used to be fashionable for the wealthy to afford to pay big money to kill a big deer,now it's considered the norm to have to pay to do it.The sad part is it won't stop until people quit paying.Thank's , I feel a little better now !

eerdog

fellas2, i believe you and I are on the same path. You might not have read my post right. i was reacting to previous poster saying that the free ride was over. So, you and I are on the same page, just believe we were both reacting to the previous poster.

fellas2

I understand, it's just so frustrating thats it's getting to the point where it's big business instead of the true sport that it used to be.I have 3 sons who hunt with me and it's becoming impossible to find a place other than paying for one.Unfortunately none of them have hundreds or thousands of dollars to pay to hunt a few days a years.People wonder why hunting license salesin Pa are declining at2.5 times the national average at a whopping 10% andit's almost impossible to get their kids into the sport,all they have to look at it the current situation all all the questions are answered.

eerdog

That is exactly right. Whatever happen to the days when you could go to a landowner and ask for permission to hunt without them thinking they have a gold mine at their door. That is the truth. Plus the fact that if you do get permission to hunt a piece of property you have to fight everyone off of it that doesn't have permission. It is getting to the point that you almost have to own your own property to be able to know you are safe and can enjoy it. The other thing about the hunting lease deal is for most leases you have it for the full year. If the lease agrees, you can camp, fish, spring hunt, fall hunt, ride atvs if the lease agrees. This guy was leasing 60 acres for a grand and was only for a couple weeks in the fall. But he did good for himself. It is definitely a "industry" that has hit commercial for sure. Everyone gets on the internet and watches the outdoor channel and sees you have to pay $3000 to hunt white tails in parts of the country, well hey the same should apply for my property. It is a extremely sad situation it is in, that is I guess if you aren't fortunate to own your own hunting land. I am not fortunate.

HEAD0001

[quote]ORIGINAL: fellas2

I guess I need to throw my two cents in. eerdog, you say the "free ride is over" ! Why ? Why is it that we have become so greedy that we now have to charge some one to hunt deer that technically don't even belong to them ?


I am the one who said the free ride is over.And whether you like it or not it is over. It is easy for you to call me GREEDY.

But I did not see you there when I was writing a check to the lawyer for $60,000 to buy the land+the fees involved. And I did not see you there when I pay the insurance agent every year. And I did not see you there when I was paying the ridiculous property taxes that I have to pay. And I did not see you there when we have to repair the fence where some idiot cut it because he did not want to get off his 4-wheeler and open the gate. And I did not see you there when we had to take the tractor out into the hayfield and fix the rut that was created by the rain because some idiot spun his tires in the hayfield.

I always hear comments like this from people who do not have a dog in the hunt. I hope some day you do own some property and then you will learn the hard way.

I drive a truck with 90,000 miles on it so that I can buy a piece of property.

When you own some property then you will LEARN. The week before hunting season you will have a dozen different guys pull up to your garage in a brand new $40,000 truck with a brand new $8,000 4-wheeler in the back. He will pile out with his buddies and just asume you will allow him the run of your farm. And then after huntintg season you will not see him till next hunting season!!

It is easy to comment on someone else when you do not have a dog in the hunt. Hunting is just like anything else, it may not be fair, but then that is life.Tom.

fellas2

Let me ask you a question,why did you buy the property ? If you bought the property with the intent on leasing it to hunters or as an investment,then you bought it for business purposes looking to turn a profit.If thats the case,don't whine about the expenses incured while running the business.Everbody that owns a business knows going in there are costs to running it,both seen and unforseen and it's part of it.If you bought it with the intention of hunting it yourself,then why are you leasing it to some one else to hunt ? Once again,you gotta expect circumstances to come up.I assure you given me permission to hunt on your property I would have gladly helped out with any chores that needed done as I have done many times in the areas I used to hunt.Alot of us out there work hard for their money(by the way I drive a 1997 ****** with 138,000 miles on it) but I'm not jealous about what others have like a new pickup or 4-wheeler and I sure as hell wouldn't expect some one to pay an outrageous amount of money just cause he has those things.My whole point was exactly what "eerdog" said,in the old days you could stop at almost any farm ,ask and get permission to hunt,maybe share some of the game,and nothing else was expected by either party.Any you probaly didn't see that guy again until next year but that's was o.k..Many a friendship was started that way and I still have those friends today.Nobody twisted your arm to buy the property,you did it because it was something you wanted,and you have the right to do with it whatever you want,but sometimes more is gained by an act of kindness and generosity than cashing the guys check one a year.

WV Hunter

We lease 1000 ac in WV....pay $3k/yr. It is owned by the family of one of our members.

I think anything over $5/acre is high....but there are definitely folks that pay it. I agree....buy your own land, they ain't making any more. I own 41 acres where I live in VA...wish I had more.

eerdog

I not sure anyone called you greedy, a good business man yes, greedy don't think so. The point was made that this is completely frustrating when you are a working class father with a young boy or girl that you want to teach and enjoy the sport of hunting and you can't do that because there is no good ole boy asking at the front door anymore. The greedy part comes from the fact that everyone wants to have lots of money and the father teaching is young son or daughter can't afford it. that was the greedy part and the part of turning the hunting past time into a commercial industry everywhere.

now the Dog in the fight, have no idea what that is all about. Also, who caused the ruts in the field, and the cut in your fence? Also so you are saying then a guy needs to drive up to your door in his beat up, old bear hunting toyota to your door? You are saying that if a guy is driving a $40K truck and has a new Polaris in the back then he should pay?

I do own my own property and don't have anyone bothering my property with cutting the fence, or rutting up the fields. Cause I will blow a hole in 4 tires, but hey you come and ask me if you can hunt on my property and I will look you over, tell you what will and won't happen and then after that I will decide. Just me though, I think that is a good business move, it just sucks that everyone thinks that is what should happen.