How long can Whitetails survive the deep freeze?
02-08-2007, 01:53 PM
#31
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 3,236
RE: How long can Whitetails survive the deep freeze?
Deer do not get pneumonia from sweating and they don't sweat anyway. They get pneumonia from panting for extended periods in the freezing temps and the accompanyingexhaustion. The dry cold air dries out their lungs and the lack of moisture in their tissues lowers their resistance to bacteria, which leads to infection. Same reason my grandmother would get bronchitis and pneumonia in the winter unless we ran a humidifier for her, which kept her lungs from drying out.
02-08-2007, 06:00 PM
#32
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: cazenovia, NY USA
Posts: 2,973
RE: How long can Whitetails survive the deep freeze?
DougE has it right about managing for the carrying capacity of the habitat. And the way its done is to manage for "worst case". For instance you redue the herd to 20 deer per square mile - if that is all the deer it will support in a BAD winter. Sure some years are mild, and it would be possible to support more deer in those years - but the lower population also gives the habitat to regenerate.
In my are - we get a decent amount of snow - (150"ish) per year mostly in DEC,JAN, & FEB. We have a fairly high deer population - 30ish deer/square mile - sometimes a little more. We also have decent agriculture with dairy farms (not as many as before though). So most of our deer don't die in a bad winter - They usually have less fawns as a result.
FH
In my are - we get a decent amount of snow - (150"ish) per year mostly in DEC,JAN, & FEB. We have a fairly high deer population - 30ish deer/square mile - sometimes a little more. We also have decent agriculture with dairy farms (not as many as before though). So most of our deer don't die in a bad winter - They usually have less fawns as a result.
FH
02-08-2007, 06:17 PM
#33
Typical Buck
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 584
RE: How long can Whitetails survive the deep freeze?
ORIGINAL: Phil from Maine
It's not? Here we have lost alot of adult deer and alot of them were pregnant does. The coyotes put the deer onto the ice causing them to hamstring and then it is over for the deer. 2 years ago 23 deer in one deer yard was killed at one location ( about 3 miles from me ) most of them were does with lambs and it was calculated to be from 52 - 54 deer had the fawns survived.
This is a true statement and it is worst in March on them if alot of snowfall has come. This makes it hard for the deer to get all the food they need for the unborn to survive.
Also predators and dogs out running deer in cold weather is very dangerous to the deer in the temps we are currently having. After the deer are run for long lengths of time they will die even if they do not get caught. This happens because the deer when run generate a large amount of body heat and when running for long periods of time releases more heat. Causing the deer to heavily sweat and when they stop the cold air cools them off to quickly causing the deer to develope pneumonia. This in turn can and will kill deer. But, cold air by itself does not appear to kill them when they are not bothered by predators or dogs.
It isn'tthe deer that die during the winter that have the biggest effect.
What really matters the most is if the preganant does maintain sufficient body weight to give birth to healthy fawns that will survive.
Also predators and dogs out running deer in cold weather is very dangerous to the deer in the temps we are currently having. After the deer are run for long lengths of time they will die even if they do not get caught. This happens because the deer when run generate a large amount of body heat and when running for long periods of time releases more heat. Causing the deer to heavily sweat and when they stop the cold air cools them off to quickly causing the deer to develope pneumonia. This in turn can and will kill deer. But, cold air by itself does not appear to kill them when they are not bothered by predators or dogs.
Here in Pennsylvania we are just far enough south that don’t have much winter mortality but we do have major fluctuations in the fawn survival rates that are induced by the fall mast crop combined with the length and severity of the winter.
As for the affects of deer dying after being run by predators that actually does occur though it is more often the result of stress myopothy (sp ?) or just the lack of being able to find sufficient food to replace the energy lost from being chased repeatedly. Stress or capture myopothy, as it is sometimes called, is the result of the animal pumping so much adrenaline into the muscle tissue that it can result in the animal dying days or even weeks later. Deer seem to be the species most prone to mortality from stress myopothy. It happens to a relatively high percentage of the deer that get captured and handled unless the incident is very short in duration. That is why our deer handling teams try to have very little and very quick contact with the research deer they capture. That is also why trap and transfer of deer doesn’t enjoy much success like it does with animals less flighty then deer.
Stress myophothy can result from the deer being stressed from any type of major disturbance while they are locked in winter yarding areas too so I suspect that is at least what happens when the deer are believed to be dying of pneumonia. As I said previously though it can also be that the deer will die simply from not being able to replace energy lost after repeated disturbance during times when food is hard to find or get to. If you do a professionally necropsy on the deer they should be able to distinguish between the various cause of death. But, in reality that most likely doesn’t happen, due to the expanse and hassles of transporting deer to a diagnostic laboratory when there is no indication of disease or anything more then normal winter affects. In fact, in the truest sense of the big picture it really doesn’t matter which deer died of starvation, predation or stress myopothy since they are all non-infectious and generally related and connected to the winter conditions.
R.S. Bodenhorn
02-08-2007, 08:26 PM
#34
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Treasure Lake DuBois,Pa.
Posts: 1,571
RE: How long can Whitetails survive the deep freeze?
R.S.B.,
MAybe I should start another thread w/ this question, but I'd like to know what your thoughts are as far as survival for this year?
The mast crop was consumed pretty early in most areas close to here.
It seems the deer are starting to eat my rhodadendren.(spell?)
If the conditions remain somewhat the same,what will be the condition of the herd locally?
MAybe I should start another thread w/ this question, but I'd like to know what your thoughts are as far as survival for this year?
The mast crop was consumed pretty early in most areas close to here.
It seems the deer are starting to eat my rhodadendren.(spell?)
If the conditions remain somewhat the same,what will be the condition of the herd locally?
02-08-2007, 09:51 PM
#35
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location:
Posts: 1,157
RE: How long can Whitetails survive the deep freeze?
ORIGINAL: germain
I highly doubt it moose because it's a dirt road on a hill which makes travel slow.And the road was basically ice covered throughout that winter which really made travel slow.
ORIGINAL: moose1915
maybe a car hit em?
ORIGINAL: germain
It was right beside the road so I couldn't tell if idiots poached them,starvation,or predators got them.Being right beside the road I'm thinking idiots shot them and left them lay.
It was right beside the road so I couldn't tell if idiots poached them,starvation,or predators got them.Being right beside the road I'm thinking idiots shot them and left them lay.
02-09-2007, 09:11 AM
#37
Typical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA
Posts: 522
RE: How long can Whitetails survive the deep freeze?
Elk will eat snow if they get thirsty enough, don't know if I've ever seen any documentaion that supports snow eating by whitetails though.
In the areas of northernPotter and Tioga countiesthat I'm familiar with, there are many spring seeps of various sizesback in the woods, that should offer some water almost all winter long. My uncle's farm across the valley from my camp, got its water from a pasture-bank spring (old cast iron ram pump),for many years before uncle had a welldrilled.
That largespring never froze, wasn't unusual to see deer out there gettin' a drink just75 yards from the barn, in very cold weather.
In the areas of northernPotter and Tioga countiesthat I'm familiar with, there are many spring seeps of various sizesback in the woods, that should offer some water almost all winter long. My uncle's farm across the valley from my camp, got its water from a pasture-bank spring (old cast iron ram pump),for many years before uncle had a welldrilled.
That largespring never froze, wasn't unusual to see deer out there gettin' a drink just75 yards from the barn, in very cold weather.
02-09-2007, 01:53 PM
#40
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Maine
Posts: 12,681
RE: How long can Whitetails survive the deep freeze?
Stress myophothy can result from the deer being stressed from any type of major disturbance while they are locked in winter yarding areas too so I suspect that is at least what happens when the deer are believed to be dying of pneumonia
perhaps you are right , however here they state it is pneumonia. So that is what I have been going by.