Magnum snobbery?
09-26-2004, 09:11 AM
#1
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hampstead, Maryland
Posts: 179
Magnum snobbery?
I own rifles chambered for magnum calibers. Off and on, over the past 40 years, I have owned a fair number of high powered hunting rifles. Holding a dealer's FFL does come with a few advantages. That said, I am, on occasion put off by snobbery concerning the use of magnum chambered rifles.
One good example was when I was flying out for a self guided hunt for elk in the Gunnison Basin, a few years back. I had packed a rifle for that trip that happened to be in 30-06. When I began to converse with the gent next to me, on the plane, he got around to what I was using for the hunt. It turned out that he also was headed out to hunt elk. When I responded that I had my rifle in 30-06, he frowned and responded, "You know, of course, that you are undergunned!" I backed out of the conversation with as much tact as I could muster and as fast as I was able. This, because the gent had destroyed any hope that I may have had about what a nice conversation we may have been able to have. He had no knowledge of my experience, marksmanship, firearms knowledge, or even that I dealt in firearms as a part of what I did for a living. He merely had in mind to put me down with his attitude and his own self perceived sense of superiority. Too bad, that so many budding acquaintences are crushed by over inflated egos and false truths!
To be overgunned or undergunned is, in the main, a question of opinion based on much broader intelligence then that gent possessed. No? I believe that had the situation been reversed, and he said that he was using a 30-30 saddle carbine to go after elk, I would've asked what sort of terrain he was hunting and how he went about finding elk? What would your response have been?
One good example was when I was flying out for a self guided hunt for elk in the Gunnison Basin, a few years back. I had packed a rifle for that trip that happened to be in 30-06. When I began to converse with the gent next to me, on the plane, he got around to what I was using for the hunt. It turned out that he also was headed out to hunt elk. When I responded that I had my rifle in 30-06, he frowned and responded, "You know, of course, that you are undergunned!" I backed out of the conversation with as much tact as I could muster and as fast as I was able. This, because the gent had destroyed any hope that I may have had about what a nice conversation we may have been able to have. He had no knowledge of my experience, marksmanship, firearms knowledge, or even that I dealt in firearms as a part of what I did for a living. He merely had in mind to put me down with his attitude and his own self perceived sense of superiority. Too bad, that so many budding acquaintences are crushed by over inflated egos and false truths!
To be overgunned or undergunned is, in the main, a question of opinion based on much broader intelligence then that gent possessed. No? I believe that had the situation been reversed, and he said that he was using a 30-30 saddle carbine to go after elk, I would've asked what sort of terrain he was hunting and how he went about finding elk? What would your response have been?
09-26-2004, 09:38 AM
#2
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: fort mcmurray alberta canada
Posts: 5,667
RE: Magnum snobbery?
I have seen it go both ways.Some people also look down on anyone using magnums and accuse them of wanting more power because they can't shoot accurately.If everyone would judge others on their abilities and not on their choice of equipment we would all get along better.
09-26-2004, 12:53 PM
#4
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location:
Posts: 1,290
RE: Magnum snobbery?
I guess he must have been reading the same gun rag articles that I read as a kid.
That type of comment just flips an "off" switch for me. I would have said something like "I see" and let it drop. His attitude will not help his accuracy any when it comes time for him to pull the trigger. But then, we count on prosperous office pogues with bruised shoulders to sell off their magnums each year so us working types can get a discount.
If you are going to the time, trouble and expense of a major hunt, I think each hunter has to do a little soul searching to choose the cartridge and action type for the kill. Once they pack it in, I figger blessings are in order. And if they are a nut case, just give 'em lots of room!
That type of comment just flips an "off" switch for me. I would have said something like "I see" and let it drop. His attitude will not help his accuracy any when it comes time for him to pull the trigger. But then, we count on prosperous office pogues with bruised shoulders to sell off their magnums each year so us working types can get a discount.
If you are going to the time, trouble and expense of a major hunt, I think each hunter has to do a little soul searching to choose the cartridge and action type for the kill. Once they pack it in, I figger blessings are in order. And if they are a nut case, just give 'em lots of room!
09-26-2004, 01:06 PM
#5
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hampstead, Maryland
Posts: 179
RE: Magnum snobbery?
I have seen it go both ways.Some people also look down on anyone using magnums and accuse them of wanting more power because they can't shoot accurately.If everyone would judge others on their abilities and not on their choice of equipment we would all get along better.
Last year, on a hunt in Durango, a hunter had a rifle chambered for 30-378. I was in awe at the size of the cartridge. I have no desire to own a rifle chambered for that caliber, but we had some good times, discussing why people like different rifles and calibers for elk hunting. He loved his big rifle, but he respected my desire to use something not as big.
09-26-2004, 03:05 PM
#7
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southern California
Posts: 323
RE: Magnum snobbery?
ORIGINAL: Steven Ashe
...He had no knowledge of my experience, marksmanship, firearms knowledge, or even that I dealt in firearms as a part of what I did for a living. He merely had in mind to put me down with his attitude and his own self perceived sense of superiority... What would your response have been?
...He had no knowledge of my experience, marksmanship, firearms knowledge, or even that I dealt in firearms as a part of what I did for a living. He merely had in mind to put me down with his attitude and his own self perceived sense of superiority... What would your response have been?
My own limited experiences have led me to firmly believe that the skill of the rifleman matters much more than the rifle, assuming one's rifle is reliable, approriate for the game intended... and sufficiently accurate to allow the rifleman to reliably place his shots in a vital area at the ranges shot will be taken.
From your description, this fellow sounded rather arrogant. Your polite disengagement probably took more self control than many of us could muster. Had this happened to me, depending on the fellow's demeanor and whether I thought he was just a boob, I might have asked him why he felt that way, and used that as an opportunity to educate a less experienced fellow. Oh well, there are none so blind as those who will not see.
By the way, did you get your elk on that trip?
09-26-2004, 03:34 PM
#8
Thread Starter
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Hampstead, Maryland
Posts: 179
RE: Magnum snobbery?
"By the way, did you get your elk on that trip? "
No. On that trip, I was able to get in far enough to see elk cows and a fair number of mule deer, but no bulls. I only had a license for bull elk. The outer ring of the park was full of outfitters who took Sports into the park on horseback. I hunted the second rifle season, so any bulls had likely been pushed farther into the park then I could walk. I did have a grand time, trekking into some gorgeous country.
Another pet peeve of mine is how many pro-guides act as if the Nat'l Forest belongs to them. I have been on both sides and have heard guides berating hunters who go into the parks, self-guided. They are benefitting from public lands, and in no way have any more right to be in there hunting then do the folk who go it alone.
No. On that trip, I was able to get in far enough to see elk cows and a fair number of mule deer, but no bulls. I only had a license for bull elk. The outer ring of the park was full of outfitters who took Sports into the park on horseback. I hunted the second rifle season, so any bulls had likely been pushed farther into the park then I could walk. I did have a grand time, trekking into some gorgeous country.
Another pet peeve of mine is how many pro-guides act as if the Nat'l Forest belongs to them. I have been on both sides and have heard guides berating hunters who go into the parks, self-guided. They are benefitting from public lands, and in no way have any more right to be in there hunting then do the folk who go it alone.
09-26-2004, 05:29 PM
#9
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Rocky Mountains, Colorado
Posts: 1,964
RE: Magnum snobbery?
IMHO, the word "magnum" don't mean anything....
Any cartridge is simply a propellent container for launching a bullet of a given diameter and weight at a given speed....
Size up your game, decide on the weight of bullet and velocity you need/want that will get the job done with room for human/random error and go for it. If "it" has the word Magnum in it, then fine --- if it doesn't then fine.
One observation though,
With the exception of the folks dealing with injuries, it seems the ones that get the biggest knot in their panties about magnums are the ones that don't have any. Folks that have them as well as a cross section of other standard cartridges -- small, medium, and large -- and then go on to comment on the subject of "magnums" strike me as more objective than those who only have the "standard" calibers and harp on the so called "magnum" issue. Steven, you appear to be in the well-diversified group (gulp) and come across as fairly balanced in your discussion.
I'll be using a 416 Rigby on elk this year (just for entertainment value), I sure hope the fellas in camp that will be toting their magnums don't give me a bad time about using a non-magnum rifle --- might give me an inferiority complex.
As a side note, we do have minimum cartridge standards for our elk camp and since implementing that rule, things have went, oh, so, so much better, though I must admit it sure does "weed out" a lot of prospective hunters --- almost as badly as the "weed out" factor from wives, employers, and "show time" issues. [
]
Generally, in my opine....
Little tools for little jobs,
Bigger tools for bigger jobs.
EKM
Any cartridge is simply a propellent container for launching a bullet of a given diameter and weight at a given speed....
Size up your game, decide on the weight of bullet and velocity you need/want that will get the job done with room for human/random error and go for it. If "it" has the word Magnum in it, then fine --- if it doesn't then fine.
One observation though,
With the exception of the folks dealing with injuries, it seems the ones that get the biggest knot in their panties about magnums are the ones that don't have any. Folks that have them as well as a cross section of other standard cartridges -- small, medium, and large -- and then go on to comment on the subject of "magnums" strike me as more objective than those who only have the "standard" calibers and harp on the so called "magnum" issue. Steven, you appear to be in the well-diversified group (gulp) and come across as fairly balanced in your discussion.
I'll be using a 416 Rigby on elk this year (just for entertainment value), I sure hope the fellas in camp that will be toting their magnums don't give me a bad time about using a non-magnum rifle --- might give me an inferiority complex.
As a side note, we do have minimum cartridge standards for our elk camp and since implementing that rule, things have went, oh, so, so much better, though I must admit it sure does "weed out" a lot of prospective hunters --- almost as badly as the "weed out" factor from wives, employers, and "show time" issues. []Generally, in my opine....
Little tools for little jobs,
Bigger tools for bigger jobs.
EKM
09-26-2004, 06:02 PM
#10
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 34
RE: Magnum snobbery?
I just can't seem to get it right no matter who I talk to. I love to shoot the 218 Bee and the 22 Hornet almost as much as the 338 Win mag, 7MMSTW, and my 458 Win Mag. No matter who I try to engage in conversation, I am always at least half wrong. Either I shoot something too big, or something to small. One of my favorite rifles is the 25-06. I like to use it for all kinds of things. When I shoot praire dogs, I am accused of trying to replace precision with size, when I take it on an elk hunt, someone always tells me how feeble it is there. I shoot 23 different calibers and no matter which one I am using, it is never the right size for somebody. It's too bad we can't just learn from each other instead of always needing to be right to justify our choices. It sure would make hunting and visiting a lot more fun and enjoyable. Sorry, I am just getting tired of always being criticized by someone just because of what caliber of rifle I choose to use.