700 trigger "unsafe"? Accu trigger "safe"?
12-29-2010, 05:35 AM
#1
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Orange county, NY
Posts: 2,949
700 trigger "unsafe"? Accu trigger "safe"?
EDIT: NEVERMIND , thanks to nomercy448, I realized the information in my post is incorrect, and I have removed the youtube video, sorry for the misinformation regarding the accutrigger
Last edited by DeerandbearhoG; 12-30-2010 at 05:33 AM.
12-29-2010, 05:55 AM
#2
Fork Horn
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Slippery Rock, Pa.
Posts: 393
I completely agree, the thing to also keep in mind is the Remmy's that where malfuctioning were modified by unqualified people. I've had my remington fire when i took the safe off or when you worked the bolt, the difference is i knew i caused it to do it. The owners manual says don't modify the trigger.
12-29-2010, 06:10 AM
#3
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Orange county, NY
Posts: 2,949
my 700 trigger has been adjusted to about 2.5lbs pull, with very little creep, and it will not fire from working the bolt or disengaging the safety, because it is properly adjusted. I have had them go off (unloaded of course) if I adjusted the trigger improperly. Point is I dont think the design is flawed, just some specific guns from any manufacturer are lemons and a gun in any unsafe persons hands is dangerous no matter how safe the design is.
12-29-2010, 10:06 AM
#4
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,915
The poster of the video is mistaken about the function of the accu-trigger.
The blade DOES NOT prevent the trigger from being pulled. The blade of the accu-trigger, aka "Accu-release", prevents the sear from fully breaking upon accidental trigger pull, dropping, or jarring. The video shows the Savage Trigger functioning properly. The trigger CAN be pulled even without pulling the blade. However, what the video does NOT show is that the rifle would NOT have actually fired. The energetic "clack" is the sear breaking from the trigger, but slamming into the accu-release stop.
The disadvantage is that if the sear DOES slip from the trigger to the sear-stop, then the bolt must be opened and closed again to transfer it back to the trigger, otherwise the rifle will fire when the blade is depressed (without the trigger being pulled). However, a shooter familiar with his rifle will feel a GREATLY higher blade pull than usual, and should recognize the problem.
From what I understand, the Remington SAFETY works just like the Savage Accu-release. The Remington safety is a trigger stop as well as sear-stop. However, if the trigger is tuned low, and the rifle is jarred to the point the sear slips from the trigger to the safety sear stop, when the safety is dis-engaged, the sear will fully break (just like the savage rifle will if the trigger has been depressed THEN the blade is pulled).
So essentially, the Savage has an additional safety feature above the Remington, and it also is EASIER to tell if the dangerous "slipped trigger" condition is present (heavy blade pull vs. essentially normal safety resistance). To fail, the remington must be dropped, then the safety released, while the Savage must be dropped, the safety released, and the BLADE pulled (which would only be done when the rifle was on target anyway).
I love both rifles, and believe both to be incredibly safe. But in the name of safety, I make a point to recycle the bolt and test the trigger if I ever do jar my rifle, regardless of brand. But YES, I do believe the Savage to be a safer trigger (and a finer trigger to boot)...
The blade DOES NOT prevent the trigger from being pulled. The blade of the accu-trigger, aka "Accu-release", prevents the sear from fully breaking upon accidental trigger pull, dropping, or jarring. The video shows the Savage Trigger functioning properly. The trigger CAN be pulled even without pulling the blade. However, what the video does NOT show is that the rifle would NOT have actually fired. The energetic "clack" is the sear breaking from the trigger, but slamming into the accu-release stop.
The disadvantage is that if the sear DOES slip from the trigger to the sear-stop, then the bolt must be opened and closed again to transfer it back to the trigger, otherwise the rifle will fire when the blade is depressed (without the trigger being pulled). However, a shooter familiar with his rifle will feel a GREATLY higher blade pull than usual, and should recognize the problem.
From what I understand, the Remington SAFETY works just like the Savage Accu-release. The Remington safety is a trigger stop as well as sear-stop. However, if the trigger is tuned low, and the rifle is jarred to the point the sear slips from the trigger to the safety sear stop, when the safety is dis-engaged, the sear will fully break (just like the savage rifle will if the trigger has been depressed THEN the blade is pulled).
So essentially, the Savage has an additional safety feature above the Remington, and it also is EASIER to tell if the dangerous "slipped trigger" condition is present (heavy blade pull vs. essentially normal safety resistance). To fail, the remington must be dropped, then the safety released, while the Savage must be dropped, the safety released, and the BLADE pulled (which would only be done when the rifle was on target anyway).
I love both rifles, and believe both to be incredibly safe. But in the name of safety, I make a point to recycle the bolt and test the trigger if I ever do jar my rifle, regardless of brand. But YES, I do believe the Savage to be a safer trigger (and a finer trigger to boot)...
Last edited by Nomercy448; 12-29-2010 at 10:16 AM.
12-29-2010, 01:39 PM
#7
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Orange county, NY
Posts: 2,949
The poster of the video is mistaken about the function of the accu-trigger.
The blade DOES NOT prevent the trigger from being pulled. The blade of the accu-trigger, aka "Accu-release", prevents the sear from fully breaking upon accidental trigger pull, dropping, or jarring. The video shows the Savage Trigger functioning properly. The trigger CAN be pulled even without pulling the blade. However, what the video does NOT show is that the rifle would NOT have actually fired. The energetic "clack" is the sear breaking from the trigger, but slamming into the accu-release stop.
The disadvantage is that if the sear DOES slip from the trigger to the sear-stop, then the bolt must be opened and closed again to transfer it back to the trigger, otherwise the rifle will fire when the blade is depressed (without the trigger being pulled). However, a shooter familiar with his rifle will feel a GREATLY higher blade pull than usual, and should recognize the problem.
From what I understand, the Remington SAFETY works just like the Savage Accu-release. The Remington safety is a trigger stop as well as sear-stop. However, if the trigger is tuned low, and the rifle is jarred to the point the sear slips from the trigger to the safety sear stop, when the safety is dis-engaged, the sear will fully break (just like the savage rifle will if the trigger has been depressed THEN the blade is pulled).
So essentially, the Savage has an additional safety feature above the Remington, and it also is EASIER to tell if the dangerous "slipped trigger" condition is present (heavy blade pull vs. essentially normal safety resistance). To fail, the remington must be dropped, then the safety released, while the Savage must be dropped, the safety released, and the BLADE pulled (which would only be done when the rifle was on target anyway).
I love both rifles, and believe both to be incredibly safe. But in the name of safety, I make a point to recycle the bolt and test the trigger if I ever do jar my rifle, regardless of brand. But YES, I do believe the Savage to be a safer trigger (and a finer trigger to boot)...
The blade DOES NOT prevent the trigger from being pulled. The blade of the accu-trigger, aka "Accu-release", prevents the sear from fully breaking upon accidental trigger pull, dropping, or jarring. The video shows the Savage Trigger functioning properly. The trigger CAN be pulled even without pulling the blade. However, what the video does NOT show is that the rifle would NOT have actually fired. The energetic "clack" is the sear breaking from the trigger, but slamming into the accu-release stop.
The disadvantage is that if the sear DOES slip from the trigger to the sear-stop, then the bolt must be opened and closed again to transfer it back to the trigger, otherwise the rifle will fire when the blade is depressed (without the trigger being pulled). However, a shooter familiar with his rifle will feel a GREATLY higher blade pull than usual, and should recognize the problem.
From what I understand, the Remington SAFETY works just like the Savage Accu-release. The Remington safety is a trigger stop as well as sear-stop. However, if the trigger is tuned low, and the rifle is jarred to the point the sear slips from the trigger to the safety sear stop, when the safety is dis-engaged, the sear will fully break (just like the savage rifle will if the trigger has been depressed THEN the blade is pulled).
So essentially, the Savage has an additional safety feature above the Remington, and it also is EASIER to tell if the dangerous "slipped trigger" condition is present (heavy blade pull vs. essentially normal safety resistance). To fail, the remington must be dropped, then the safety released, while the Savage must be dropped, the safety released, and the BLADE pulled (which would only be done when the rifle was on target anyway).
I love both rifles, and believe both to be incredibly safe. But in the name of safety, I make a point to recycle the bolt and test the trigger if I ever do jar my rifle, regardless of brand. But YES, I do believe the Savage to be a safer trigger (and a finer trigger to boot)...
OK so what youre saying is, even though it appears the firing pin has been released, it is actually just the sear itself, and the pin does not move forward?
Wow, I guess I am wrong to have posted this. I just assumed the firing pin was moving forward aswell. I could have sworn the other accutrigger rifles I owned, would not allow the trigger to be pulled if the blade was not depressed, but I guess I was wrong.
Thanks for the info. I will remove the video, but 1st I wanna go home and see what happens if I put a 209 primer in it (muzzleloader and no its not loaded).
12-29-2010, 02:28 PM
#8
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,915
When the accu-trigger came out and I noticed how it funcitoned, I did some live fire tests of my own. Yes, it sounds like the pin is closing, but the rifle didn't go bang. It's deceiving like the Ruger Revolvers or Marlin Leverguns, in both of which the hammer falls, but the gun still doesn't go bang... It LOOKS as if it's failing when you do dry fire demonstrations, but it's not.
12-29-2010, 04:08 PM
#9
Spike
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Oregon
Posts: 12
I am not bashing Remington but the issues they are having is something that even the creater of the model 700 is familiar with and was many years ago, it occures in old and new guns alike as well as factory guns and modified guns. The malfunction is not pregidous. As for the Accu trigger, I have only owned one savage with it and it worked fine for the time I had the gun but I only had the gun for a little less then a year. I have never heard myself of any issues that savage had with their guns at all. I also want to note that I did hunt with a model 700 that my dad has this deer season. I also want to add that I have infact seen a NIB 700 fail and the gun discharge without touching the trigger. I have recently leaned that if you run ammo that has a soft primer (the primer metal being soft) that a gun can be discharged just by hitting that bolt/hammer firmly if the primer is not seated properly.
I also givin some tips on purchasing a model 700 as I was considering purchasing a .243 youth model 700 for my daughter. The things to look for are as follows:
"Look it over closely for defects. Take a bore light and closely examine the bore and chamber, I have heard of a few with burrs in the chamber. Check to see if the trigger is centered in the triggerguard, not off to one side. Check to see if the scope mounting holes appear to be centered on the top of the receiver." - roklok
I also givin some tips on purchasing a model 700 as I was considering purchasing a .243 youth model 700 for my daughter. The things to look for are as follows:
"Look it over closely for defects. Take a bore light and closely examine the bore and chamber, I have heard of a few with burrs in the chamber. Check to see if the trigger is centered in the triggerguard, not off to one side. Check to see if the scope mounting holes appear to be centered on the top of the receiver." - roklok
12-30-2010, 08:14 AM
#10
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Kansas
Posts: 3,915
Deerandbearhog, No worries on the "mistake". At least you had the common sense and took the time to execute a science based experiment to test the theory, instead of just passing along second-hand conjecture that you "heard from a buddy" as if it were gospel...