What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR? (Updated with Pictures on the 4th Page)
01-26-2009, 12:41 PM
#11
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,519
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
Here is a target I shot at 100 yards with my muzzle loader with 100 grains of powder and a 295 grain Powerbelt Hollow Point. The one to the left is where it shot. I adjusted the scope and shot the center 3. If it can do this why can't my 30-06?
Anyway, I did shoot a group of 3 with the Fusions that were all inside that line you see around the bullseye. Not the bullseye but the line an inch away from it. The one all three of these shots are in. However, not one of the bullets hit the bullseye but all 3 were inside there. Actually I fired a few more later which were also inside of there. However, with most of the others it's all over this sized target.
Anyway, I did shoot a group of 3 with the Fusions that were all inside that line you see around the bullseye. Not the bullseye but the line an inch away from it. The one all three of these shots are in. However, not one of the bullets hit the bullseye but all 3 were inside there. Actually I fired a few more later which were also inside of there. However, with most of the others it's all over this sized target.
01-26-2009, 01:05 PM
#12
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: central Ky
Posts: 2,867
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
Just get some good old fashioned sandbags and fill with either sand or fine lead shot. That "sight vise" is JUNK. Not only is it entirely too light, but they are wobbly and cause the P O I to be slightly off too.
01-26-2009, 02:29 PM
#13
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: South Dakota
Posts: 2,862
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
I'd check to make sure the screws are tight for your bases and rings on the scope first thing. I sighted in a Browning BAR for a neighbor a few years ago in 25-06 and the best 3 shot group I could get out of that rifle (brand new rifle) was about 1.5". The trigger pull was my biggest issue. All of my centerfires have trigger work done to them, and going from a 2.5-3lb trigger that breaks like glass to a stock BAR trigger was tough.
01-26-2009, 03:22 PM
#14
Typical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location:
Posts: 819
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
ORIGINAL: hometheaterman
As for cleaning it I've been using Wipe Out and cleaning until it gets clean. I've tried other things but this is what I've found to get the most out as well as a local gunsmith recommended saying he liked the best. I have never used the JB Bore paste though. Do you know where the best place to find this is as I'm not sure if I've ever seen it. It usually takes a while and several hours to get it clean but I can get it to where the patches are coming out clean. I can also look down the barrel and it looks clean but that's hard to see. The patches coming out clean are what tell me it's clean. I then run a patch through with gun oil on there before I put it up to store. I usually fire a fowler shot also before I start shooting however, in my testing I've noticed that the first shot is usually very close to where the rest are.
When testing I almost always load one at a time in there and let the bolt go forward. This is how I've almost always done it. Very seldom do I load the magazine up and just keep shooting unless I'm hunting. Although, I have done it a time or two. Usually I put one in and pull the bolt back and slightly open the magazine door and let the bolt go. You have to either reach inside and push the piece on the magazine down or open the door slightly for it to go forward. I usually do this each shot. Maybe I should try doing 2 like this then loading the magazine like you said and see what it does. This thing is draining my pocket as ammo is not cheap at $30 a box so I've been trying to shoot it as little as possible since like I said I've shot up probably $3-500 of ammo this year alone. Well, 08 so last year I guess now.
As for the shells I'm shooting I'm using 150 grain Fusions. I was originally using 165 Grain Winchester Soft Points but they were always sold out at our local Wal-Mart so I switched to 150 grain and I had some old Fusions in 150 so I tried them and it's what grouped the best. I've tried the Core Lokts though in 165 grain and I got horrible groups from them. Should I try a 180 grain bullet out? I just hate to adjust my scope for a 180 grain bullet then it not be much better and have to re adjust it for a 150 or 165 grain bullet.
As for cleaning it I've been using Wipe Out and cleaning until it gets clean. I've tried other things but this is what I've found to get the most out as well as a local gunsmith recommended saying he liked the best. I have never used the JB Bore paste though. Do you know where the best place to find this is as I'm not sure if I've ever seen it. It usually takes a while and several hours to get it clean but I can get it to where the patches are coming out clean. I can also look down the barrel and it looks clean but that's hard to see. The patches coming out clean are what tell me it's clean. I then run a patch through with gun oil on there before I put it up to store. I usually fire a fowler shot also before I start shooting however, in my testing I've noticed that the first shot is usually very close to where the rest are.
When testing I almost always load one at a time in there and let the bolt go forward. This is how I've almost always done it. Very seldom do I load the magazine up and just keep shooting unless I'm hunting. Although, I have done it a time or two. Usually I put one in and pull the bolt back and slightly open the magazine door and let the bolt go. You have to either reach inside and push the piece on the magazine down or open the door slightly for it to go forward. I usually do this each shot. Maybe I should try doing 2 like this then loading the magazine like you said and see what it does. This thing is draining my pocket as ammo is not cheap at $30 a box so I've been trying to shoot it as little as possible since like I said I've shot up probably $3-500 of ammo this year alone. Well, 08 so last year I guess now.
As for the shells I'm shooting I'm using 150 grain Fusions. I was originally using 165 Grain Winchester Soft Points but they were always sold out at our local Wal-Mart so I switched to 150 grain and I had some old Fusions in 150 so I tried them and it's what grouped the best. I've tried the Core Lokts though in 165 grain and I got horrible groups from them. Should I try a 180 grain bullet out? I just hate to adjust my scope for a 180 grain bullet then it not be much better and have to re adjust it for a 150 or 165 grain bullet.
Have you considrered buying ammo from one of the catalog internet shops? They are much cheaper than the brick and mortars. If you feel bad, approach them and tell them what you can get it for. Just make sure you include the shipping per box in your estimate as to what internet sale costs you over what the gun shop sells it to you for. Ask them if you can get a multi box discount. If they won't do it just go to the internet store. I like doing business local if I can but I have to do what's best for me also. I can't justify paying 50-100% more for ammo to keep the guy down the street in business.
The J-B bore paste is available at Brownells. Your local store can get it if you ask him to. http://natchezss.com/product.cfm?contentID=productDetail&prodID=AG0 83065002&prodTitle=J%26B%20BORE%20CLEANING%20C OMPOUND
Here's your fusion ammo at NAtchez 22.34 a box. Buy several and save. It dilutes the shipping per box. http://natchezss.com/Ammo.cfm?contentID=productDetail&prodID=FAF300 6FS3&prodTitle=30%2006%20SPRING%20180%20GR%20F USION%2020%2FBX
01-26-2009, 04:04 PM
#15
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,519
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
Have you considrered buying ammo from one of the catalog internet shops? They are much cheaper than the brick and mortars. If you feel bad, approach them and tell them what you can get it for. Just make sure you include the shipping per box in your estimate as to what internet sale costs you over what the gun shop sells it to you for. Ask them if you can get a multi box discount. If they won't do it just go to the internet store. I like doing business local if I can but I have to do what's best for me also. I can't justify paying 50-100% more for ammo to keep the guy down the street in business.
The J-B bore paste is available at Brownells. Your local store can get it if you ask him to. http://natchezss.com/product.cfm?contentID=productDetail&prodID=AG0 83065002&prodTitle=J%26B%20BORE%20CLEANING%20C OMPOUND
Here's your fusion ammo at NAtchez 22.34 a box. Buy several and save. It dilutes the shipping per box. http://natchezss.com/Ammo.cfm?contentID=productDetail&prodID=FAF300 6FS3&prodTitle=30%2006%20SPRING%20180%20GR%20F USION%2020%2FBX
The J-B bore paste is available at Brownells. Your local store can get it if you ask him to. http://natchezss.com/product.cfm?contentID=productDetail&prodID=AG0 83065002&prodTitle=J%26B%20BORE%20CLEANING%20C OMPOUND
Here's your fusion ammo at NAtchez 22.34 a box. Buy several and save. It dilutes the shipping per box. http://natchezss.com/Ammo.cfm?contentID=productDetail&prodID=FAF300 6FS3&prodTitle=30%2006%20SPRING%20180%20GR%20F USION%2020%2FBX
Cheaper than Dirt is $30.something on that ammo too. Natchez is the only one I've found that cheap and everytime I've checked it's been out of stock. Then you have to pay a crazy shipping charge on it so it makes it end up costing more. You have to order several boxes usually just to save anything. So when it was about the same price it was way cheaper to just get it from the gun shop. Not sure what I will do now.
On all other ammo I've gotten I've checked online and usually get it for right around that price and don't have to pay shipping or if it's something Wal-Mart sells I almost always get it cheaper than the online prices and still don't have shipping.
That's the only reason I haven't been ordering it online. Shipping tends to make it higher unless you order a ton.
Ammo prices at least in this area have gone up like crazy lately.
Do you guys think the Federal Soft Points would shoot as well as the Fusions? Is it worth trying them? They are a fair amount cheaper.
01-26-2009, 04:06 PM
#16
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,519
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
ORIGINAL: Rammer
I'd check to make sure the screws are tight for your bases and rings on the scope first thing. I sighted in a Browning BAR for a neighbor a few years ago in 25-06 and the best 3 shot group I could get out of that rifle (brand new rifle) was about 1.5". The trigger pull was my biggest issue. All of my centerfires have trigger work done to them, and going from a 2.5-3lb trigger that breaks like glass to a stock BAR trigger was tough.
I'd check to make sure the screws are tight for your bases and rings on the scope first thing. I sighted in a Browning BAR for a neighbor a few years ago in 25-06 and the best 3 shot group I could get out of that rifle (brand new rifle) was about 1.5". The trigger pull was my biggest issue. All of my centerfires have trigger work done to them, and going from a 2.5-3lb trigger that breaks like glass to a stock BAR trigger was tough.
01-26-2009, 04:24 PM
#17
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: South Dakota
Posts: 2,862
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
Have you ever tried any of the cheap Remington Core Lokts out of it? My dad has an old Winchester Model 100 in 308, and it prefers the cheapest ammo you can feed it. He tried playing with all the "premium" ammo before his last elk hunt, and end up shooting the cheapest ammo he could buy (at the time about 8.99 a box).
01-26-2009, 08:05 PM
#18
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,519
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
ORIGINAL: Rammer
Have you ever tried any of the cheap Remington Core Lokts out of it? My dad has an old Winchester Model 100 in 308, and it prefers the cheapest ammo you can feed it. He tried playing with all the "premium" ammo before his last elk hunt, and end up shooting the cheapest ammo he could buy (at the time about 8.99 a box).
Have you ever tried any of the cheap Remington Core Lokts out of it? My dad has an old Winchester Model 100 in 308, and it prefers the cheapest ammo you can feed it. He tried playing with all the "premium" ammo before his last elk hunt, and end up shooting the cheapest ammo he could buy (at the time about 8.99 a box).
01-27-2009, 01:23 AM
#20
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: SE PA
Posts: 163
RE: What are resonable groups to expect from a Browning BAR?
Your scope may have a paralax problem at ranges geater than 50 yrds. Does your scope have an adjustable paralax or is it fixed? Clamp your rifle in the vise and look through the scope at a 100 yrd target. Now move your head back and forth (up, down,left, right)slightley. If the crosshairs move off the bull signifacantly, this could be your problem. 