Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
#12
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
Yep, that looks like a 7.7 Jap to me, but the bolt is hacked up. Cross reference it to this sportered one (but don't buy it, as I am buying it next week, lol.)
http://www.williamlarkinmoore.com/product_details.asp?id=1680
The prewar ones were reknowned for their receiver strength, the late war ones were reknowned for their weak receivers. I would do a few pull string/vice shots before putting it to your shoulder. My grandfather hunted exclusively with a 7.7 Jap and made my uncle and father use them as well. I am planning on making two sporters out of two 7.7 Japs as we speak to give to them as gifts this year(and getting flamed bad at AR15.com for doing it too, funny reading http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=14&t=233345&page=1)
Apparently Hornady makes a good hunting round for it, and the ballistics for the round are good.
www.cabelas.com/prod-1/0037464215974a.shtml
http://www.williamlarkinmoore.com/product_details.asp?id=1680
The prewar ones were reknowned for their receiver strength, the late war ones were reknowned for their weak receivers. I would do a few pull string/vice shots before putting it to your shoulder. My grandfather hunted exclusively with a 7.7 Jap and made my uncle and father use them as well. I am planning on making two sporters out of two 7.7 Japs as we speak to give to them as gifts this year(and getting flamed bad at AR15.com for doing it too, funny reading http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=14&t=233345&page=1)
Apparently Hornady makes a good hunting round for it, and the ballistics for the round are good.
www.cabelas.com/prod-1/0037464215974a.shtml
#13
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,476
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
Definitely an Arisaka. But what I like about the package is the vintage old Weaver KV scope. It wasn't a true variable in that it didn't go from the advertised 2.5 or 2.75 or 3 power on up to the 5 lower at the top ... it was one or the other. The smaller adjustment on the bolt side that is rearward and a bit smaller is the switch for the selecting the lower or the higher power .. but you couldn't go halfway and have say 3.75X... it was either or. I have a couple of them and they are really pretty nice scopes. The 2 I have are clear and distortion free although not as bright as some higher end scopes of today. But they are way brighter and better than my naked eye! Older Weavers like that one (in good shape) are a pretty good purchase for your a gun. Reliable, strong and pretty worry free. Both mine sport the post and crosshair reticle which I love for woods hunting.
#14
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: S.W. Pa.-- Heart in North Central Pa. mountains-
Posts: 2,600
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
I guess I don't understand.....Why would anyone buy a gun for someone else to hunt with when you don't even know what to feed it???....Let alone some obviously hacked military piece??
#15
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 357
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
Earl, I say do your own thing and screw the fools over at AR15. They seem like a bunch of ignorant idiots anyway. Props to you for making customized guns.
8mm/06 - That is an old Weaver scope, well spotted! It is a fixed power one, might put it on a different gun to see if it holds "zero".
Pawildman - I had been waiting for you, there is always some idiot that makes some dumb comment on someone elses thread. Got nothing good to say? Then STFU.
8mm/06 - That is an old Weaver scope, well spotted! It is a fixed power one, might put it on a different gun to see if it holds "zero".
Pawildman - I had been waiting for you, there is always some idiot that makes some dumb comment on someone elses thread. Got nothing good to say? Then STFU.
#16
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,476
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
Take off the rear side cover, it will unscrew. You'll find that you can change the power from a low of 2.5, 2.75 or 3 up to the high power of 5.
It's a DUAL power scope, not a real variable but I think it was Weaver's first entry into the field of scopes with more than one fixed power.
I'm sure you'll find some notation on it somewhere that says KV .
And some of the very early ones may not have even had the writing on it, so even if you can't find the writing, take off that rear side cover(smaller one) and turn it either direction while looking through the scope. The adjustment (under the cover cap) usually has an arrow on it with the power # indicated. Look through it, then try turning it. I think you'll be surprised and happy with the utility that you never knew it had!
Enjoy!
It's a DUAL power scope, not a real variable but I think it was Weaver's first entry into the field of scopes with more than one fixed power.
I'm sure you'll find some notation on it somewhere that says KV .
And some of the very early ones may not have even had the writing on it, so even if you can't find the writing, take off that rear side cover(smaller one) and turn it either direction while looking through the scope. The adjustment (under the cover cap) usually has an arrow on it with the power # indicated. Look through it, then try turning it. I think you'll be surprised and happy with the utility that you never knew it had!
Enjoy!
#17
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,476
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
BTW, any gunsmith will be able to tell you it's caliber by trying to chamber a 7.7 or a 6.5 Japanese round. It might be necessary to have a chamber-cast done to fully determine it's chamber and condition.
If it was a 6.5 x 50 Japanese round when originally produced that doesn't mean that it is still spec-ed for that round. It could be shot out with a throat that is eroded, or it could have been re-cut to 6.5 X 257, a popular wildcat for the 6.5 japanese rifles- as it solved the problem of obtaining Japanese brass or having to size from ones own brass.
I can't remember if there were any common conversions for the 7.7 chamber.
I have an old chopped up Model 44 carbine whose bore is pretty rough and the throat is so eroded that it will chamber and fire 6.5 X 54 Mannlicher Schoenner cartridges. The rounds keyhole from 50 to 100 yards and accuracy sucks.
I have actually acquired another barrel in very good condition in the original 6.5 x 50 (not completely military original though,... it was originally a full length 6.5 Japanese barrel that was cut down to 20 inches, turned down a bit and then target crowned) I'm seriously thinking of having it's chamber recut to a different 6.5 chamber, probably 6.5 X 55, and use it as a cabin/truck gun.
If you have one of the older ones with quality workmanship and strength, it has an enormously strong action.
Ackley's tests of action strengths found the Arisaka to be remarkably bullet-proof (no pun intended).
During repeated test firing of a 6.5 arisaka whose chamber had been cut to fit a 30-06 round (yes that's right, the chamber accepted the round even though the bore size was still only .264") after repeated firing the .308 diameter powerful round through the 6.5 barrel until finally the barrel was sent downrange!!! The action was not damaged !!!!
In fact it is reported that on tests llike this they would often just re-barrel the action and continue testing. I'm reporting what I've read in more than a few written accounts.
If it was a 6.5 x 50 Japanese round when originally produced that doesn't mean that it is still spec-ed for that round. It could be shot out with a throat that is eroded, or it could have been re-cut to 6.5 X 257, a popular wildcat for the 6.5 japanese rifles- as it solved the problem of obtaining Japanese brass or having to size from ones own brass.
I can't remember if there were any common conversions for the 7.7 chamber.
I have an old chopped up Model 44 carbine whose bore is pretty rough and the throat is so eroded that it will chamber and fire 6.5 X 54 Mannlicher Schoenner cartridges. The rounds keyhole from 50 to 100 yards and accuracy sucks.
I have actually acquired another barrel in very good condition in the original 6.5 x 50 (not completely military original though,... it was originally a full length 6.5 Japanese barrel that was cut down to 20 inches, turned down a bit and then target crowned) I'm seriously thinking of having it's chamber recut to a different 6.5 chamber, probably 6.5 X 55, and use it as a cabin/truck gun.
If you have one of the older ones with quality workmanship and strength, it has an enormously strong action.
Ackley's tests of action strengths found the Arisaka to be remarkably bullet-proof (no pun intended).
During repeated test firing of a 6.5 arisaka whose chamber had been cut to fit a 30-06 round (yes that's right, the chamber accepted the round even though the bore size was still only .264") after repeated firing the .308 diameter powerful round through the 6.5 barrel until finally the barrel was sent downrange!!! The action was not damaged !!!!
In fact it is reported that on tests llike this they would often just re-barrel the action and continue testing. I'm reporting what I've read in more than a few written accounts.
#18
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: S.W. Pa.-- Heart in North Central Pa. mountains-
Posts: 2,600
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
ORIGINAL: ir655
Earl, I say do your own thing and screw the fools over at AR15. They seem like a bunch of ignorant idiots anyway. Props to you for making customized guns.
8mm/06 - That is an old Weaver scope, well spotted! It is a fixed power one, might put it on a different gun to see if it holds "zero".
Pawildman - I had been waiting for you, there is always some idiot that makes some dumb comment on someone elses thread. Got nothing good to say? Then STFU.
Earl, I say do your own thing and screw the fools over at AR15. They seem like a bunch of ignorant idiots anyway. Props to you for making customized guns.
8mm/06 - That is an old Weaver scope, well spotted! It is a fixed power one, might put it on a different gun to see if it holds "zero".
Pawildman - I had been waiting for you, there is always some idiot that makes some dumb comment on someone elses thread. Got nothing good to say? Then STFU.
#19
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 246
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
If I could see the top of the receiver clearly, I could tell you if it was origonally a Type 77 (7.7 Jap) or Type 38 (6.5 Jap). As someone else said, it could have easily been rechambered though. At one time it was fairly popular to rechamber the 7.77's to 30-06. Although the weren't very accurate since you had a .308 bullet and a .311 barrel. The only safe way to tell the caliber is by a chamber cast.
#20
RE: Need Help ID-ing rifle and caliber..
ORIGINAL: ir655
Just got this rifle for my sister, looked like decent gun to shoot deer with. The only thing is that the guy that sold it to me didn't know diddly squat about it. Kind of strange, but anyway. There are no markings on the barell about caliber type, only a serial number. The serial reads 93265, there is a small "A" I believe before the numbers.
Here are some pics of the rifle. If anyone knows what caliber it is I would appreciate it!
Just got this rifle for my sister, looked like decent gun to shoot deer with. The only thing is that the guy that sold it to me didn't know diddly squat about it. Kind of strange, but anyway. There are no markings on the barell about caliber type, only a serial number. The serial reads 93265, there is a small "A" I believe before the numbers.
Here are some pics of the rifle. If anyone knows what caliber it is I would appreciate it!
The 7.7X58mm Japanese is a pretty powerful cartridge, in the same class as the .303 British. If it is a 6.5X50mm, it is in the same class as the .260 Remington. Not quite as powerful. But either round is plenty for deer hunting!
Someone has done you the courtesy of mounting a scope on it for you. Both those old Weaver fixed-power scopes andd the Weaver mounts are excellent! I still use several rifles myself that have those old Weaver scopes on them. They still work well.
You can get ammo from GRAF'S. http://www.grafs.com/ammo/239