.280?
11-03-2006, 06:12 PM
#61
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 3,476
RE: .280?
I think that there seems to be some mixing of facts. A 150 grain .284 bullet and a 150 grain .308 bullet are the same amount of projectile. The fact that one can create a larger ENTRY hole isn't really telling much. Bullet construction and velocity mean a heck of a lot more than the diameter, especially the minimal difference between .284 and .308. Basically we're talking about 7mm and 7.5 mm (approx).
There is such a small difference between the .280 and the 30/06 I wouldn't even bother with choosing between the 2. If there were 2 identically equipped rifles except for chamber, one being 30/06 and the other being .280 I would be happy to be carrying either afield.
There is no question though, availablility of ammo is a key consideration to those that don't handload, and therefore marketability is definitley affected.
There is such a small difference between the .280 and the 30/06 I wouldn't even bother with choosing between the 2. If there were 2 identically equipped rifles except for chamber, one being 30/06 and the other being .280 I would be happy to be carrying either afield.
There is no question though, availablility of ammo is a key consideration to those that don't handload, and therefore marketability is definitley affected.
11-03-2006, 06:22 PM
#62
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location:
Posts: 1,572
RE: .280?
ORIGINAL: DM
I really like the 7mm's, and i love my custom 7 express Rem.... I've harvested aLOT of game with it, and it's served me well.... BUT, i have to admit, if i was going to use a cal for a steady diet of "bigger" game (read moose) i'd pick the 30-06 every time over the 7 express/280... I don't give a crap what the load tables say!
Only proof i have, is the 25 years of hunting big animials in Alaska and another 20years + in otherstates and Canada... I reload everything and rarely buy factory ammo, and in my life when it came to guns, money was "nearly" no object, because if i wanted it i figured out how to get it! PEROID!!
So, all the proof i can offer is my years of hunting with all of the cals mentioned in this thread so far, andmany more for weeks at a time in the bush, a few months out of every year...
BTW, "If" being paid by the goverment to shoot animials makes you a pro, i've done that too so i guess ? i'm a pro???
DM
I really like the 7mm's, and i love my custom 7 express Rem.... I've harvested aLOT of game with it, and it's served me well.... BUT, i have to admit, if i was going to use a cal for a steady diet of "bigger" game (read moose) i'd pick the 30-06 every time over the 7 express/280... I don't give a crap what the load tables say!
Only proof i have, is the 25 years of hunting big animials in Alaska and another 20years + in otherstates and Canada... I reload everything and rarely buy factory ammo, and in my life when it came to guns, money was "nearly" no object, because if i wanted it i figured out how to get it! PEROID!!
So, all the proof i can offer is my years of hunting with all of the cals mentioned in this thread so far, andmany more for weeks at a time in the bush, a few months out of every year...
BTW, "If" being paid by the goverment to shoot animials makes you a pro, i've done that too so i guess ? i'm a pro???
DM
Velocity is more important than physics which is why we don't keep designing larger bullets, we design ways to push the bullets we use faster.
BTW: "If" you do something for a living and you're good at it then I think you can be considered a "professional" and I'm not one to brag but it seems like "experience" goes alot further around here than "logic" so I guess I can pull the experience card too.
Funny how experience only seems to matter when other people use it as some kind of proof, but when I do all the sudden being a "pro" doesn't mean a thing! Make up your mind you can't have it both ways! Oh darn there's that silly logic thing again! Keeps getting in the way....
11-03-2006, 06:25 PM
#63
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location:
Posts: 1,572
RE: .280?
ORIGINAL: 8mm/06
I think that there seems to be some mixing of facts. A 150 grain .284 bullet and a 150 grain .308 bullet are the same amount of projectile. The fact that one can create a larger ENTRY hole isn't really telling much. Bullet construction and velocity mean a heck of a lot more than the diameter, especially the minimal difference between .284 and .308. Basically we're talking about 7mm and 7.5 mm (approx).
There is such a small difference between the .280 and the 30/06 I wouldn't even bother with choosing between the 2. If there were 2 identically equipped rifles except for chamber, one being 30/06 and the other being .280 I would be happy to be carrying either afield.
There is no question though, availablility of ammo is a key consideration to those that don't handload, and therefore marketability is definitley affected.
I think that there seems to be some mixing of facts. A 150 grain .284 bullet and a 150 grain .308 bullet are the same amount of projectile. The fact that one can create a larger ENTRY hole isn't really telling much. Bullet construction and velocity mean a heck of a lot more than the diameter, especially the minimal difference between .284 and .308. Basically we're talking about 7mm and 7.5 mm (approx).
There is such a small difference between the .280 and the 30/06 I wouldn't even bother with choosing between the 2. If there were 2 identically equipped rifles except for chamber, one being 30/06 and the other being .280 I would be happy to be carrying either afield.
There is no question though, availablility of ammo is a key consideration to those that don't handload, and therefore marketability is definitley affected.
Yes. Bullet design is very important because you can make all the energy in teh world but if it doesn't transfer into the target it's wasted. That is why we want a big game bullet that will mushroom and lodge against the opposite hide, thus expending all it's energy inside the target.
Like I said in the beginning: all the mainstream big game calibers are pretty much the same within 300 yards. It's splitting hairs like I said.
11-03-2006, 07:14 PM
#64
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 493
RE: .280?
Damn, this has been fun and I havn't even stirred the pot at all. Brutal. I want my bullet to pass completely thru, a better blood trail. That little extra sd the 7 mm has on paper is just that (on paper) as it will not become evident at any intelligent hunting range. And my main use of paper is to wipe my butt.
11-04-2006, 08:36 AM
#65
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,695
RE: .280?
Sorry Brutal but you are mistaken. Energy is not the deciding factor in what kills. The hole and tissue damage is. A bullet that stops inside an animal will not leave as much damage as one that fully mushrooms and blows through an animal. That talk about expending all it's energy is farse.
11-04-2006, 08:38 AM
#66
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location:
Posts: 1,572
RE: .280?
ORIGINAL: [email protected]
Damn, this has been fun and I havn't even stirred the pot at all. Brutal. I want my bullet to pass completely thru, a better blood trail.
Damn, this has been fun and I havn't even stirred the pot at all. Brutal. I want my bullet to pass completely thru, a better blood trail.
ORIGINAL: [email protected]
That little extra sd the 7 mm has on paper is just that (on paper) as it will not become evident at any intelligent hunting range. And my main use of paper is to wipe my butt.
That little extra sd the 7 mm has on paper is just that (on paper) as it will not become evident at any intelligent hunting range. And my main use of paper is to wipe my butt.
11-04-2006, 08:50 AM
#67
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Texas
Posts: 2,695
RE: .280?
ORIGINAL: BrutalAttack
Yes. Bullet design is very important because you can make all the energy in teh world but if it doesn't transfer into the target it's wasted. That is why we want a big game bullet that will mushroom and lodge against the opposite hide, thus expending all it's energy inside the target.
Yes. Bullet design is very important because you can make all the energy in teh world but if it doesn't transfer into the target it's wasted. That is why we want a big game bullet that will mushroom and lodge against the opposite hide, thus expending all it's energy inside the target.
Actually this is the dumbest thing I have heard a hunter say.You my friend still have a lot to learn.
11-04-2006, 09:16 AM
#68
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location:
Posts: 1,572
RE: .280?
ORIGINAL: zrexpilot
Actually this is the dumbest thing I have heard a hunter say.You my friend still have a lot to learn.
Actually this is the dumbest thing I have heard a hunter say.You my friend still have a lot to learn.
All I can say to that is.....wow.
You really have no clue what a bullet is supposed to do.
But then again judging by your bullet choice on that deer I guess I shouldn't be suprised.
Then you have the nerve to tell me I have alot to learn?
LOL......wow.
Well if nothing else you've impressed me with your idiocy.
11-04-2006, 10:45 AM
#70
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Saskatchewan Canada
Posts: 6,921
RE: .280?
HEAD0001, heated debate amongest friends is a common thing, the end results is usually agree to disagree and move on!
Best of luck to you. I admire the determination you show and realize how much it takes to overcome the cards in which you'vebeendealt. I have a daughter whohas Muscular Dystrophy, it is so severe she is confined to a wheelchair and has very limited muscular function. Though she is an amazing little girl and done more than my wife or I had ever invisioned. Attends regular school and extremely smart(brains came from momma I recon), operates a power chair, mouse, etc with her feet and hand over hand on the flooris a pretty good little writer and artist. She has done more in her 7.5 years on earth than I could in lifetime, a sweetheart and blessing to our family.
!Best of luck to you. I admire the determination you show and realize how much it takes to overcome the cards in which you'vebeendealt. I have a daughter whohas Muscular Dystrophy, it is so severe she is confined to a wheelchair and has very limited muscular function. Though she is an amazing little girl and done more than my wife or I had ever invisioned. Attends regular school and extremely smart(brains came from momma I recon
), operates a power chair, mouse, etc with her feet and hand over hand on the flooris a pretty good little writer and artist. She has done more in her 7.5 years on earth than I could in lifetime, a sweetheart and blessing to our family.