huntingson

No, I don't think it has to be one or the other. The # of huge bucks coming from ILL are virtually all from "controlled lands". What I mean there is lands that are under QDM programs of some sort. State lands are going in the wrong direction. So, the state is doing terribly.

ILL deer definitely have the genetics (generally speaking), but the only places that they are allowed to grow to their potential is on private/outfitted land. So, where ILL may have the most potential, it is doing a horrible job of herd management IMO based on research I have seen.

Splitear_Leland

There you have it everyone, directly from the mouth of an Illinois resident. Unless you hunt with an outfitter you are wasting your money. No need to lease any ground, it all sucks. Just pay an outfitter, they are responsible for the rebound of the whitetail deer in Illinois, the very species that 20 years ago was all but extricated. Then the outfitters being the saviors they are came to Illinois, and said, "this place is a joke!". Then they waved their magic wand and said "let there be deer". And from that moment on Illinois has become one of the most populated, if not over populated deer states anywhere. Give me a break. Try not to believe everything you read in the funny papers dude.

P.S. The abbrev. for Illinois is IL.

huntingson

So, then the question is, would that land be producing the deer that it is without the outfitters strictly managing it? I don't think so.

But once again we are only talking whitetails, and I only brough up ILL as an example of outfitters at least managing things well.

BTBowhunter

First of all, Thanks for the compliment on some of my deer. However you might be interested to know that two of those bucks are from PA. No outfitting involved, but I do work very hard to get and keep permission to hunt my honey holes in PA. Also, two more came from a Pike County property that my gang lost to a local outfitter.

Second, nothing is free I put serious time into it. I just happen to pay for my hunting in something other than cash.

englum_06

huntingson

First off, Illinois is overpopulated with deer, but that has nothing to do with what I was talking about. Wouldn't an overpopulation be another sign that the management practices are not working? Thanks for helping me make my point.

I also said outfitters AND private land owners, which, and correct me if I am wrong, is the land that is leasedI have never heard of a hunter leasing public land, but who knows what you goofy people do If by funny papers you mean the main publications that release whitetail research studies, then I don't know what to tell you. You are in denial because THE MAN came and stole "your" precious hunting land.

It isn't like I am gaining anything by saying that Illinois management is doing poorly. Do some research and by all means correct me if you find valid information.

One good resource for this is the November 2007 issue of Deer & Deer Hunter.

Lastly, do you hate all outfitters or just white tail outfitters in Illinois? Serious question.

Germ

I have no idea

My first guided trip will be Ohio Turkey Hunt this year.

So far Ihave been insullted and toldI have to feed myself and sleep in the barn

THWACK_007

You are exactly correct about that. The state of Illinoishas donenothing to help the management of the deer heard. I 100% agree with you on that. Even with what the outfitters are doing trying to balance the population and what not, it is still out of whack.


Its pretty much like anything else in life, some people like it and some people dont. Outfitting is a business just like anything else. Land owners have found a way to make more money off their land becausehunters are willing to pay the money. So why do you blame the outfitters for leasing the land? It is a business! If you dont like it then start your own outfitting business and go lease the land you want. Or if you have always hunted that ground then go pay the landowner more than the outfitter is willing to pay an dlease it yourself. You cant expect to have everything free forever just because you had it for a for years. Its not the welfare system! The people whoare so against outfittersare the ones who cant afford them or have lost land to them because they afford to lease the land for themselves. Its just the way it is.Its a business just like anything else. I am sure thatmany people that are against outfitters are in some business themselvesthat I can piss and moan about.

englum_06

I would absolutely love for you to tell me how one man/family is supposed to pay a farmer more than what an outfitting business can. Must have some pretty deep pockets or something.

BTBowhunter

Maybe the thing to do is get everyone together that wants to hunt his property and pool your money. Just like any hunting club anywhere else.
My guess is that, all things being equal, most farmers would rather lease to a small group of their neighbors.

Another option is to lease the ground yourself and let a few hunters on for a fee to help you pay your lease. You keep control but the cost stays down. Of course then, technically, you'd be an outfitter yourself....one of the bad guys