bowhunting accuracy test?
07-03-2007, 10:10 PM
#11
Giant Nontypical
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: The OH-IO
Posts: 7,103
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
No. I would not be in favor of it. While I understand your point I think the government tries to control us enough. It's a damn shame, but one bad apple spoils the bunch. I for one am pretty tired of having to adapt to the "bad apples" of the world. The fact of the matter is, it's a free country ( supposedly ) and if someone wants to get their bow out 2 days before season and shoot 5 arrows, then deem themselves worthy of hunting.........Well, so be it. I don't agree with it, but I would be against legislation trying to control it even more.
I think the good apples have to stand above the bad and attempt to sway the attention away from the bad......Just my 2 cents......
I think the good apples have to stand above the bad and attempt to sway the attention away from the bad......Just my 2 cents......
A lot of good points here.
I see it (pulling bow out the day before the season) a lot as it is what my step dad, his brothers and their buddies do each fall.....
Just the other day when a buddy was over my house shooting my step dad stopped by to pick up some spare lumber I had.My buddy and Iwere playing a game of archery pig we werestanding a mere 30 yards from the deer target. My step dad says "what are you doing all the way back here..... you are going to lose all your arrows it's inevitable!"
He was being serious
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07-03-2007, 10:15 PM
#12
Giant Nontypical
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: The OH-IO
Posts: 7,103
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
ORIGINAL: Greg / MO
GREAT question, Scott...
And equally as good an answer mobow.
I actually agree with both concepts; as a pretty hardcore, right-wing conservative, I agree whole-heartedly with Donnie. But... I'm gonna waffle a bit as I think through this and say that you've got a great point, buckeye.As someone who's about as serious about bowhunting as you can be, I love being an ambassador for our sport, and often times think that -- while not necessarily the standards I hold myself to need to be put into place -- that sometimes we do need standards.
I had the extreme displeasure of a co-worker a few years ago who found out I was a bowhunter want to go hunting with me. We ended up hunting a couple times together, and I saw him gutshot a deer, shoot another in the hip, wound a turkey, and wound a bobcat in those couple hunts. I was appalled, and we went our seperate ways. Oh wait... we hunted three times together, because the first time out together, I put him in one of my best spots and he wounded a legitimate 150-class bruiser; I know he was because he cameby my stand after he shot him, though I didn't know it at the time. I wondered why I couldn't grunt him over to me.. I got a friend of mine to take me up in his private plane the next day and we circled the area for 10 minutes as I looked over the CRP field he went into with binos. [:@]
The problembecomes who administers? Who sets policy? Does it -- like mobow said -- open the door for more restrictions from anti-hunters down the road? (This would have to be weighed VERY carefully, and is the reason my initial reaction would be to say "no") There's a LOT to think about here...
GREAT question, Scott...
And equally as good an answer mobow.
I actually agree with both concepts; as a pretty hardcore, right-wing conservative, I agree whole-heartedly with Donnie. But... I'm gonna waffle a bit as I think through this and say that you've got a great point, buckeye.As someone who's about as serious about bowhunting as you can be, I love being an ambassador for our sport, and often times think that -- while not necessarily the standards I hold myself to need to be put into place -- that sometimes we do need standards.
I had the extreme displeasure of a co-worker a few years ago who found out I was a bowhunter want to go hunting with me. We ended up hunting a couple times together, and I saw him gutshot a deer, shoot another in the hip, wound a turkey, and wound a bobcat in those couple hunts. I was appalled, and we went our seperate ways. Oh wait... we hunted three times together, because the first time out together, I put him in one of my best spots and he wounded a legitimate 150-class bruiser; I know he was because he cameby my stand after he shot him, though I didn't know it at the time. I wondered why I couldn't grunt him over to me.. I got a friend of mine to take me up in his private plane the next day and we circled the area for 10 minutes as I looked over the CRP field he went into with binos. [:@]
The problembecomes who administers? Who sets policy? Does it -- like mobow said -- open the door for more restrictions from anti-hunters down the road? (This would have to be weighed VERY carefully, and is the reason my initial reaction would be to say "no") There's a LOT to think about here...
I would be called a fence sitter on this issue as I do see pros and cons of the idea.
I may be wrong but I believe their are states (Alaska?) that do require this.
07-04-2007, 01:27 AM
#13
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Harford Co Maryland USA
Posts: 4,966
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
I used to hunt on one of the military installations around here. In order to hunt there, you had to pass a proficiency test (among other things). It can be a bit nerve wracking when there's 50 or so people standing there watching you shoot before they get their chance. I think it's a good idea to help weed out those who don't practice and just grab a bow and go hunting (believe me, I've met some). On the other hand, the mobs that would line up there would be a big obstacle to this. I see it from both sides, but I'd favor making the test a part of getting a license.
07-04-2007, 01:55 AM
#14
Typical Buck
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Western New York
Posts: 639
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
I know a guy who shoots awesome at a target put him in front of a deer he can't shoot to save his life. Would be incredibly hard to implement a plan fairly, as well as push some of those people who desperately want to join the legions of us arrowslingers away. When I started bowhunting I had no one to show me the ropesat 14 i didn't realize you probably should practice w/ broadheads or tuning a bow was necessary (did'nt it comed tuned ?) I just don't like the thoughts of pushing some people w/ out an experienced mentor away Or what if you practice all summer and you still are at best are a really terrible shot. Don't deprive one for lack of natural ability. I do however hate the thought of wounded deer but thats the reality we pretty much have all done it even if we shoot quite good!
07-04-2007, 05:14 AM
#15
Typical Buck
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Nanjemoy, MD
Posts: 998
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
Proficiency Testing
Would I be in favor of it? - yes.
Would it be practical to administer- no.
I used to conduct proficiency testing for a military base many years ago. I too have seen otherwise competent (?) archers fold under the pressure of folks watching them. I also got a lot of "Gee, my broadheads fly differently from my field points!?". I am no longer a tester, but I still get tested every year to hunt there.
Amore practicalapproach would beto require completion of the National Bowhunter Education Program class. Some states require it, most don't. At least the unwashed masses might learn something that would help the sport we all love.
There are folks who shouldn't be allowed to carry a bow into the woods, sit behind the wheel of a car, or type on a computer, lol. I agree, there is no practical way to weed them out, the price of a free society...
-fsh
Would I be in favor of it? - yes.
Would it be practical to administer- no.
I used to conduct proficiency testing for a military base many years ago. I too have seen otherwise competent (?) archers fold under the pressure of folks watching them. I also got a lot of "Gee, my broadheads fly differently from my field points!?". I am no longer a tester, but I still get tested every year to hunt there.
Amore practicalapproach would beto require completion of the National Bowhunter Education Program class. Some states require it, most don't. At least the unwashed masses might learn something that would help the sport we all love.
There are folks who shouldn't be allowed to carry a bow into the woods, sit behind the wheel of a car, or type on a computer, lol. I agree, there is no practical way to weed them out, the price of a free society...
-fsh
07-04-2007, 06:51 AM
#16
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location:
Posts: 21,043
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
I'd be more in favor of a required bowhunters' education course. During the course...... the importance of proficiency could be drilled into the students heads.
That's about as far as I'd go.
Stick a man on the ground and tell him to hit a plate @ 20 yds??? OK...I don't think that's going to weed out many people. Put him in a classroom of his peers.....and explain to him why we don't take quartering-to shots at any distance (etc..., etc..., etc...).....and you'll have educated him.
I'd rather educate him and take my chances he'll learn the importance of becoming "proficient".
That's about as far as I'd go.
Stick a man on the ground and tell him to hit a plate @ 20 yds??? OK...I don't think that's going to weed out many people. Put him in a classroom of his peers.....and explain to him why we don't take quartering-to shots at any distance (etc..., etc..., etc...).....and you'll have educated him.
I'd rather educate him and take my chances he'll learn the importance of becoming "proficient".
07-04-2007, 07:50 AM
#17
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,102
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
I am in favor of a proficiency test.I know it is a slippery slope but there are far to many people who don't put the practice time in and shouldn't be in the woods.
I have two thoughts about performance anxiety,one is someone gets all nerved up and can't shoot in front of people what is going to happen when they have a big buck within shooting range? A practical solution is to have the proficiency test be in a private area where the shooter is alone with the monitor.
I have no tolerance for the slob hunters and if it means losing them so be it!
I have two thoughts about performance anxiety,one is someone gets all nerved up and can't shoot in front of people what is going to happen when they have a big buck within shooting range? A practical solution is to have the proficiency test be in a private area where the shooter is alone with the monitor.
I have no tolerance for the slob hunters and if it means losing them so be it!
07-04-2007, 08:09 AM
#18
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Phoenixville, PA USA
Posts: 5,541
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
I'm kind with Greg on this in that I'm very on the fence about this subject. On one hand, a very good friend of mine's father is a true blue gun hunter. With a gun in his hand he is very lethal, however, with a bow he needs a quiver full of arrows because he'll likely shoot them all...in one hunt! We encourage him to practice, but he does so very little and does not tune his equipment. An accuracy test would benefit him greatly.
On the other hand, one property I used to hunt required a permit and to get the permit you had to pass an accuracy test. All you had to do was hit the mid-section of a deer targetat 10, 15, and 20 yards. There were guys with arrows in the spine, in the gut area, in the brisket, that all got permits. Where and how do you set the criteria?
While the thought of a test is good, the practicality in administering and the challenge of setting the qualifying requirements make it very difficult to put into practice.
On the other hand, one property I used to hunt required a permit and to get the permit you had to pass an accuracy test. All you had to do was hit the mid-section of a deer targetat 10, 15, and 20 yards. There were guys with arrows in the spine, in the gut area, in the brisket, that all got permits. Where and how do you set the criteria?
While the thought of a test is good, the practicality in administering and the challenge of setting the qualifying requirements make it very difficult to put into practice.
07-04-2007, 08:19 AM
#19
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 2,435
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
The underlying assumption is of course that a proficiency test would result in more efficient kills and therefore less suffering. I don't think that would be the case at all. Cripling losses are imo the result of hunters taking low percentage or what you might say are unethical shots.Everyoneregardless of their prowesshas a maximum effective range. Everyone is also quite susceptable to yielding to the temptation of taking shots where the kill zone is not properly exposed as opposed to not getting a shot at all. With a little thought I'm sure ou can come up with other situations where even an outstanding shot winds up wounding an animal because his ethics allow him to push the envelope well behond his ability.He'sjust hoping to get lucky and when he's not the animal pays the price. No way to test for this. I think though well intentioned proficiency testing would merely add bureacracy with no benefit.
07-04-2007, 08:34 AM
#20
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,102
RE: bowhunting accuracy test?
I don't disagree about the bureacracy,that is what I was referring to when I used the term slippery slope.From a wounding perspective though I don't agree, a competent archer is far more likely to make a killing shot then an incompetent one.
Having some control over competency is a step in the right direction.We will never be able to legislate a hunters shot selection,thats between them and their conscience.
Having some control over competency is a step in the right direction.We will never be able to legislate a hunters shot selection,thats between them and their conscience.