early in

All I'm going to add is this,if you want to hunt Canada for anything, and your a non-resident,you MUSThave a guide or a host. Period. There may be a small area in Ontario where you don't , but that's about it.Take it from there.

early in

I was going to avoid this thread because there are many ways to view an "outfitted" hunt, but.Everyone expects diff things from a guide. Me, all I want is to be put in an area known to be productive. Alot of the time this means hunting private property, which most guides have access to.
This past Nov I hunted in Alberta. Onthe 5th day ofmy 6 day hunt Igot a buck. I hunted from dark to dark each day. I walked through up to 2 1/2 feetof snow(drifted fields) for about 1/2 a mile to get to my stand area and the same coming out.Not an easy hunt. All my guide really did was drop me off in the morning and pick me up after dark. He didn't sit out with me in the 16-22 degree(F) weather for 10hrs a day. I placed my own climber where I wanted it.
The buck I killed via my "guide" means every bit as much to me as any other deer I've gotten with my bow. The main thing is I'm hunting some premiere properties that I couldn't access without a guide. It's the same story with alot greatareas in the mid west as well.

Elkcrazy8

To me it would depend on the individual circumstances. A guy who put in his effort on a hunt deserves some credit where credit is due. Guided hunts provide better chances granted, however the drive to keep after it comes into play, hunting is hunting. A guy who puts in sun up to sundown days on end, even under the guidance of a guide or outfitter did put in some dues.

Lets take another animal just for kicks. I have taken several folks elk hunting, even though I knew where the elk would be, these hunters gave every last bit of energy they had just to get into camp, let alone get up before daylight every day and walk 5-10 miles before noon. We took a pope and young bull a few years back on a hunt, did that guy deserve respect, heck yes he did. He paid his dues and deserves every bit of respect.

I would take my hat off to a guy who takes on the extreme and goes down the path less traveled even if he used a guide, as long as he puts in his dues. Not all guided hunts are easy. Some DIY are easy.

Lets take two DIY hunters, one takes a pope and young buck on public land, and the other takes his on private ground that has been managed for big heads. Lets take a guided hunt where many miles have to be covered in harsh weather on public ground, and lets compare that to a guided hunt on private ground where a guy steps out of a heated cabin and shoots his animal on the edge of a private field. I would go with the harder hunts in either case, be it guided or unguided.

I don't believe that an outfitter coming into play has anything to do with respect, it all boils down to the hunt and the type of circumstances as they unfolded. Each hunt deserves its own respect.

I have some friends that guide in AZ and into Mexico, and know that the hunts are real tough on both the guide and the hunter. Would that hunter that crawled with his guide through rattlers and cactus in the heat of the Mexico desert for whole week to stalk a Cous or Mui Grande , deserve less respect than the guy that hangs a tree on the back of his clover lot to kill the buck that he has patterned to a 30 minute window. In my book, he would deserve more.

buckeye

I would say 50% is pretty good odds..... That's basically a book buck every other year.

How often does the average hunter tag a P&Y cailber animal?What do you suppose the % is for one to shoot a P&Y on their own each year? I would say no where near an every other year average like you posted.

Don't take me wrong, like I said there is nothing wrong with an outfitted hunt, it looks like fun and you can bet your arse ifa buddyof mine had a hot stand out of state I would sit in it [8D]

TFOX

I respect all hunters.


Let's put this spin on it.If a hunter takes a record(or book)buck on managed property regarded any higher or lower than one taken ona guided hunt on umanaged land?[8D]

Buck Magnet

My opinion is this, it still takes the same thing to kill the buck on a DIY or on a guided hunt. You have to be where the buck is, you have to put your time in stand, you have to practice scent control, be patient, be still, and you have to make the shot.

As far as the "well a guide tells you everything about the deer" comment, how many people on here discuss their hunting area with their buddies? How many people talk to the farmers who own the property they hunt on? How many people discuss hunting area's with the guys at the local pro shop? To me, thats no different than a guy who talks to a guide and the guide tells him where they have been seeing a big buck, and where he thinks he should be set-up. I am pretty confident that the local farmer who's property I hunt knows just as much about where the deer are on his property as a guide does for his lease. I talk to the landowners of all the properties that I hunt and they are always giving me alot of advice, they live on their property and most of them spend a good part of their days out on their property so they know whats happening with the deer herd. Does that mean that all of my hunts are "tainted"?

One other thing to think about as far as difficulty of a guided hunt goes, which would you feel more comfortable with, having somebody tell you the patterns of deer on a property that you have never stepped foot on or being on your own property and seeing it unfold before your eyes?

With that said, I have never been on a guided hunt but I am currently researching some outfitters in Buffalo County Wisconsin for a possible hunt in 2008. I feel that it will be a nice change and I feel that it will be every bit as rewarding as hunting here in PA. Its a change of scenary and a new style of hunting.

Hiawatha

IMO deer that are taken by the aid of an outfitter are not as big of an achievement as a DIY hunt. Like many here have stated the stands are often hung for them, all scouting is done, here the stands are heated, etc. To me it just doesn't seem the same. I do not have a problem using outfitters heck i was trying to become one b4 i came to college but couldn't get a licence. However what i cannot stand is the people who clearly have no clue about hunting mature deer going on a guided hunt, shooting a gagger from their little heated box blind and then bragging non stop for the rest of their life. I think we all know people like this. cough cough.
Somewhere in this post i read something about owning lots of land with big deer on it. Not going to go back and sift through where it came up. We own a good chunk of land here andsask produces some good bucks however there is a big misconception that these things are wandering around aimlessly sucking on the end of an arrow or bullet. There are some huge deer yes but they don;t get that way being stupid. You have to hunt them hard like any other area if you want to kill a good deer year after year. Yes my standards may be raised a bit due to the deer i am blessed with here but to kill something 160+ consistently you gotta know your stuff. I have friends here who have hunted hard since they 12 and have never taken a buck over 140. It just doesn't happen, you have to make it happen, same as any other place.

TJF

It's hard to compare one guided hunt to another due to the different animals and terrain one would experience. Since we are just talking deer and probably just whitetailsince that is whatBuckeye askedin hisquestion... comparing coues deer to a whitetail is apples to oranges. Two different animals in many respects. Comparing elk to Whitetails also falls under that. But even if we are talking any animal... a DIY would still be more of an accomplishment if we are talking acoues huntto a guided coues hunt, elk hunt to a guided elk hunt, and a whitetail huntto a guided whitetail hunt. To pull it off yourself ( to me ) is the highest accomplishment one can do.

In " early in's " case where a guide is required, you can't compare that to a place where a guide isn't required. He was stuck with a guide. Sounds like he did his own hunting though, so I would be darn proud to.

I have helped ( non payed guiding I suppose ) a lot of people huntover the years with my son being one of them. Is it the same as a guided hunt?? Not even close to me. I am there to teach andhelp them to be better hunters and become self suffiecent. That is a big difference to me verses a guide who gets payed to find them a good animal for repeat bookings in the years to comes. They might teach a hunter a little depending on the hunter but it isn't to wean them from needing and wanting to use a guide. You don't make money that way which is their business. Granted they are also looking for a good reccomendation from previous hunters to future clients. With that said,I wouldn'tenvy a guide packing hunters in on horses for elk,climbing mountains after goats or a lot of the BIG GAME hunts. Tough job!! It doesn't compare to aWhitetail guided huntthough. Since the guide is with the hunter 100% of the time during the hunt for BIG GAME,I imagine they pass along a lot of useful information verses aguide on a whitetail hunt. Their service is quite a bit different then a guided deer hunt to my thinking.

Is it wrong to use a guide, tosit in a friends stand, get help from other hunters. Heck no!! As long as you are happy that is what is important. A DIY is still a bigger accomplishment to me especially for whitetail or any animal. I could still get enjoyment out of the others though.

Tim

GMMAT

Fair question, I think.....

If there weren'tadvantages to a guided hunt......why would people do it?

PreacherTony

I have to agree 100% here. If I was paying thousands of $ to have a chance at a big bull elk, I would be expectingan above chance at killing one.

Would it be less of an accomplishment? There is still a lot involved to harvest an animal, assuming it's in a fair chase situation, that it would depend on the hunt itself. Example .. . If I hunt a particular bull all week,he keeps giving the guide and me the slip, but in the end, I successfully take the animal, I would feel just as accomplished as if I shot a big buck at home, after hunting hard all week.

On the other side, I would feel more satisfied with said elk hunt, than I would if I hunted a stand that someone put me in and I shot an animal in the first hour aof light, after doing zero work ..... but that's me