Scent-Lok G.Designer

Thanks. Some of my replies may take some time to post as this is not my only assingment. But I will help when I can.

jerseyhunter

I my self am an advid believer and user of you products. And as you stated I toss my stuff in the dryer when ever possible. I have several pairs of gloves and head cover to alternate with. For those who don't believe, just go hunting a day with a face mask on and breath into it all day after, breakfast, lunch and dinner in a stand, let alone sweating. Put it on the next day for another hunt and see if it doesn't stink. Throw that same head gear in the dryer and it's a totally different story. However I do wash them afterevery other dryer escapade. As far as washing the rest of my scent-lok gear , once maybe twice a season. the dryer takes care of the rest..
Thank you SLGD for the reply.

atlasman

Can you please elaborate on the science behind these claims. I don't quite understand how it takes 800 degrees and pyrolysis to restore nearly 100% of the absorptive properties of carbon yet you can get 90% back by putting it in a household dryer. I was also wondering...........wouldn't the dryer need to be scent free also?


Could you provide information or a link to this independent lab testing. There really is no information on the link above as to how, where, and by whom the test was done.


This is what lead me to my above question............your test link above says independent testing and this quote suggests you do the testing yourselves. Just want to clarify.


Going by your above statement that you only get 85-90% back in the dryer and starting at 100% when you get the suit it will only be 50% effective after 4 regenerations and totally ineffective after less then 20.

Suit starts at 100% and you regenerate to 85%
Next regeneration takes you from 85% down to 72.25%
Next regeneration takes you from 72.25% down to 61.41%
Next regeneration takes you from 61.41% to 52.20%.............and so on.

Since you must regenerate when first buying the suit to get all the scent out that was picked up by many people trying the garment on in the store and being handled by the masses.........this only leaves you 3 dryer runs before the suit is half used up.

Please help me out if I am figuring that incorrectly...........but I don't see how you could return to 85-90% each regeneration since if you are starting out at 85-90% after your first cycle that would mean in order to maintain that level you would be getting 100% regeneration from each additional dryer run...........which in turn would make the suits last forever.


I hope you stick around..............I am very interested in this topic and hopefully you can answer some of the questions I have.

Scent-Lok G.Designer

To your first point. Huan scent is not chemically or physically bonded to the activated carbon. On a molecular level activated carbon is basically millions of caves in which scent molecules get "lost" and as they proceed down the caves get "stuck" until the cave fills up. The drying process, and I am going to confirm the scientific name for this, heats the molucules causing them to move and work their way out of the caves. During the first ten minutes or so of a drying cycle with activated carbon in it, the activated carbon is adsorbing scent from the dryer. After this time the airflow and heat reach a point to where this scent being exhumed and exhausted out the vent. Yes, some stays in there and will be adsorbed by the garment again. This accounts for part of the 10-15% that stays in the garment.

Still on your first point, the reactivatiion process (using high heat etc.) gets rid of compounds that have bonded with the activated carbon. Again, this is taken into account for in the 10-15% number.

To your second point, activated carbon has been tested around the world for water filtration, chemical filtering, insoles, and an array of other scientific and commercial industries. These are industries that are completely independent of ours and their testing data shows that activated carbon can adsorb odor and molecules. The testing data shown in the graph is funded by us at a third party laboratory. We cannot show you that actual data as there is confidential information about other technologies in it, even other techologies in this very industry; but showing that data could hurt our partnerships in the long run. I am checking with our lawers to see if I can post the lab, as their may be confidentiality issues, don't count on it though.

However our tests were performed using the Headspace GCMS system to assay odorous compounds after equilibration with various textile substrates. We used an Agilent 6890A gas Chromatograph equipped with an Agilent 5973 Mass Selective Detector, a Leap Technologies Combi Pal Autosampler and a Phenomenex 30m x .53 mm ZB-5, um film column. A 22 mL headspace vials with Teflon-sealed septa. A human scent cocktail containing a mixture of trimethylamine, dimethyl sulfide, isobutyraldehyde, ethanol, isovaleric acid, and limonene. This kind beats non-regenerated suits in a field and boxes huh? javascript:void(AddText(''))

Third point I think I addressed as we pay for some and some are independent, but Oaklahoma State has done a lot of testing on this subject as well as many other labs around the world.

Fourth point, the effect you are referring to is not compounded on top of each other. Like a sponge water molecule A,B,C go into a sponge. Wring out Molucule A & B and wipe up more molecules D,E. Wirng out again and molecules C & E are then wrung out leaving now only molecule D. After proper regeneration, 10-15% of total capacity will be filled up, leaving 85-90% to use.

Lastly, the "scientific" study you referred to before has a lot of holes. How old are the suits, how many washes, how were they reactivated, what type of footwear were the subjects wearing, where did they walk before getting into the boxes, did the ATV that took them to the box leave any scent, who lifted the box over the subjects head, were they wearing gloves, what did they touch before they lifetd the boxes. All of these things directly add scent to an area and were not accounted for in the "scientific" test.

shed33

Scent Lok Designer,

Dang, and I thought I was the Lone Ranger around here Mobowhunter and I! Thanks for the imput. I have been field testing your product for 7 years and have witnessed many positive deer, elk and bear behaviors while downwind of me. Along with annual bowharvests Iam confident that your product combined with a meticulous scent minimization regimen will up the odds in any hunting/scouting/glassing/videoing situation of even the most human scent intolerant animals.



Atlas what a change in tone and attitude as I read yournearlyeloquent and curtious questions... I must compliment you...... especially with an obvious paid employee of Scent lok....He just gets paid to say this stuffright?

Just think.....rememberthat information I shared with you in regards to regeneration and desorption versus reactivation...the dryer...etc.. may not of been as much of a SCAM orwaste of moneyas you called it. Heck we might even find out that Scent lok does'nt mind us bowhunters field testing thier products for ourselves and giving feedback....beforebelittling it and everyone that choses to use it.

HeyI am still patiently waiting for you toanswer my questions in regards toexperiences/harvests you have personally hadwithmature bucks downwind, bowclose most preferably.....I am asking because I want to know how they reacted to your human scent and what you do to minimize human scent it if anything at all.

6 days and counting... to archery season !

BowHuntingFool

Excellent post here.

Scent-Lok G.Designer...thanks for the info, very helpful!!!! I too hope you stick around, not just to answer questions either...post away! Good luck.

atlasman

Do you have a link to the study you are quoting this from?


I have no doubts of the ability of carbon to absorb...........my questions involve it's ability to keep doing it for long periods of time after being "used up"


Funded by you.........and we can't see the results. Call me skeptical but that isn't very convincing to me. I'm not saying that those aren't really the results...........but basically your above response means I just have to take your word for it.


The equipment list doesn't really help answer anything...........the details of how the "study" was done would be much more helpful


I don't know........you haven't told me anything about your study yet. You just listed some chem lab equipment.


They have done tests on your suits?


I'm sorry but that doesn't make sense. If a dryer is unable to remove 15% of scent from the carbon during one cycle why would it be able to do it next time?

If you are saying that a carbon suit can be regenerated to 85% efficiency after EVERY dryer cycle then the suits last forever.

Again, please provide a link to the science you are quoting with these claims.


The same can be said for all of your claims to this point. Where is the study that shows these suits can be regenerated to 85-90% effectiveness in a dryer?........does that go for every dryer?.......every cycle?.......does the scent go out the vent like you said in every dryer after 10 minutes? Does the lint trap have to be empty? How can anyone know if their suit is regenerated or not?

That is why I asked for the study details..........at least the field test study on the dogs was done by someone that has no interest in the outcome either way and all the parameters were laid out for everyone to see........I'm sure the test wasn't perfect as very few are.........to totally discount it as meaningless and offer nothing but a line graph on your site seems a little unfair to me.

atlasman

Right.

I have no problem being polite when I feel the respect is mutual.

Yea, I remember.............and I am still waiting on the science to back it up. All you offered was a D+DH article. It may not have been.........but it still may be. I haven't seen anything yet that would change my opinion.


Of course they wouldn't mind...........if you're testing it.......you bought it Plenty of people have posted on this forum saying that they wore carbon suits and they didn't work at all............aren't you belittling them with your above comments?


And like I told you already...........answer the questions I posed to you first and then I will answer your questions.

Porter Rat

Scent-Lock G. Designer,

Great to hear what you have to say about scent containment systems. I am a believer in this technology.

I have always been very weary of my scent trail (no cologne from September to January, wash in scent free soap only from September to January, wash ALL garments in scent free sport wash, etc.) and I have always been able to get fairly close to animals. I was sceptical, but when I did begin using the suit I was even more impressed at how close game would come.

For instance, last fall: I hadmultiple deer throughout the season come under my stand (±2') and not flinch an inch. I had a mature 8 pt. come under my stand and smell my step then procede to walk about 15 yards away and lay down for a nap. I could go on and on but this stuff does work.

It would be good to hear some other peoples experiences because I cannot be the only one.

Thanks G.D.

Deer902

G. Designer, How long does an activated carbon suit typically last? Is there any tests that we can do ourselves to check that the suit is still working?