Turbo Nock
08-10-2004, 10:11 AM
#11
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 106
RE: Turbo Nock
Hi this is the TURBO NOCK GUY !
I do not want this to get into being a commercial ad for my product, but I was told about this site and would at least like to explain and defend my product a little.
We have been in business for two years now. Two years ago when we attended our first ATA show there were only 12 archers shooting the TURBO NOCK. Now there are about 100,000 and we recently were picked up by Cabela's and Mountain Archery Catalogs.
This does not usually happen to gimmicks!
The biggest problem we have found with new shooters using the TURBO NOCK is that THEY WILL NOT READ THE INSTRUCTION SHEET!!!!
BOTTOM LINE
Every arrow ever made ,and arrows have been traced back in time 30,000 years , has used feathers or vanes and only the resistance of the wind to stabilize them. The TURBO NOCK with its unique patented twisted nock uses the same principle of stabilization as rifles. A bullet is mechanically spun from a gun barrel and requires no fletching. A TURBO NOCK is mechanically spun from the bowstring and can fly with 80% less fletching than a conventional arrow.
Most new TURBO SHOOTERS try to tune the arrow the same way they tuned their old fletched arrows. This does not work!
The TURBO when tuned properly will shoot through a whiskerbiscuit, and a fallaway rest with excellent results. The issue of FOC is also of concern for an arrow leaving the bow with no spin. If you foc is off at the beginning of flight the arrow wobbles the entire flight.
Three four inch plastic vanes and a conventional nock weigh on the average 46grains. The DEADX weighs 44 grains and the Hunter 54 grains and the htx 37 grains. THERE is no foc issue . ALSO an arrow spinning instantly from between 4000 and 8000 rpm eliminates any foc issue.
A quarter back throws a bullet pass!! why is it called that???
A football that is thrown properly and is instantly spun by the hand of the quarterback does not wobble and no one fletches footballs.
A TURBO NOCK has more in common with a bullet than an arrow.
Some archers complain of noise. We have been using them for hunting for two years and sponser two hunting shows on the sportsman channel and have taken most big game in the world, and not one animal has been able to duck or jump a shot!!! NOT ONE COMPLAINT FROM ANY ANIMAL.
If you would like more info go to our website www.turbonock.com
I am new to this site and hope I have not broken any rules???
I do not want this to get into being a commercial ad for my product, but I was told about this site and would at least like to explain and defend my product a little.
We have been in business for two years now. Two years ago when we attended our first ATA show there were only 12 archers shooting the TURBO NOCK. Now there are about 100,000 and we recently were picked up by Cabela's and Mountain Archery Catalogs.
This does not usually happen to gimmicks!
The biggest problem we have found with new shooters using the TURBO NOCK is that THEY WILL NOT READ THE INSTRUCTION SHEET!!!!
BOTTOM LINE
Every arrow ever made ,and arrows have been traced back in time 30,000 years , has used feathers or vanes and only the resistance of the wind to stabilize them. The TURBO NOCK with its unique patented twisted nock uses the same principle of stabilization as rifles. A bullet is mechanically spun from a gun barrel and requires no fletching. A TURBO NOCK is mechanically spun from the bowstring and can fly with 80% less fletching than a conventional arrow.
Most new TURBO SHOOTERS try to tune the arrow the same way they tuned their old fletched arrows. This does not work!
The TURBO when tuned properly will shoot through a whiskerbiscuit, and a fallaway rest with excellent results. The issue of FOC is also of concern for an arrow leaving the bow with no spin. If you foc is off at the beginning of flight the arrow wobbles the entire flight.
Three four inch plastic vanes and a conventional nock weigh on the average 46grains. The DEADX weighs 44 grains and the Hunter 54 grains and the htx 37 grains. THERE is no foc issue . ALSO an arrow spinning instantly from between 4000 and 8000 rpm eliminates any foc issue.
A quarter back throws a bullet pass!! why is it called that???
A football that is thrown properly and is instantly spun by the hand of the quarterback does not wobble and no one fletches footballs.
A TURBO NOCK has more in common with a bullet than an arrow.
Some archers complain of noise. We have been using them for hunting for two years and sponser two hunting shows on the sportsman channel and have taken most big game in the world, and not one animal has been able to duck or jump a shot!!! NOT ONE COMPLAINT FROM ANY ANIMAL.
If you would like more info go to our website www.turbonock.com
I am new to this site and hope I have not broken any rules???
08-10-2004, 12:39 PM
#13
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 5
RE: Turbo Nock
I have been using some form of these nocks for some time now and the only little quirk I had with them was getting them to tune ... You have to realize that with Turbos you can not tune the arrow to the bow you have to tune the bow to the arrow ....... With my McPherson Edge as with some other Hybrid cam systems I have to nock the arrow just under 1/8" low ...... IMHO Mr. Snook has developed something that could revolutionize the archery industry and by the products being carried by Cabela's and Mountain Archery they apparently thought the product was good enough for them to offer to their customers ..... If anyone has any questions regarding Turbos or needs any help do not hesitate to email me @ [email protected] and I will try my best to help you or put you in contact with someone who can ......
Thanks and Keep 'em in the 10
Mike
Thanks and Keep 'em in the 10
Mike
08-10-2004, 03:00 PM
#15
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 2,175
RE: Turbo Nock
i talked to a dealer who is shooter and seen the turbo nocks in use at a shoot i think he said atlantic city new jersey and they werent performing all that well that day.( maybe his bow wasnt tuned to the arrow?) he also told me that he talked to the turbo nock guys about his store carrying them and he turned it down because of what he saw. he was also told at that time cabelas was picking them up and my local pro shop guy wasnt immpressed by this at all . i would think any new latest greatest that can generate a good cash flow would interest a company like cabelas even if it is only popular for a year or two because people are just buying to try them because of a buzz about a product. cabelas sells what i would think is junk or gimmicky all the time. for years i would buy stuff like this all the time but have learned through the years now to question new gear more and ask alot more questions.after all im pretty sure the guys who invented the clapper and the pocket fisherman are a millionare because people bought because of curiousity and ended up just throwing them in a drawer never to be used again if you know what i mean. im still waiting on my brothers report buti will let everyone know what his thoughts are.
08-10-2004, 04:05 PM
#16
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 106
RE: Turbo Nock
Three years ago I had a pro shooter (Steve Boylan) shoot prototype TURBO NOCKS
in several tournaments. If I remember correctly He placed very well in the Ill state Championships. He Shot at Vegas and shot a 298 first day which put us in 80th place, a 299 the second day and we moved up to 70 th place on the third day he shot a 300 and we finished up in 50th place out of a total of 4000 archers including probably 200 of the best in the world.
Not to shabby for prototype. He then went to Atlantic city and did not do well. This is the only pro to shoot my product. Dustin Yokum who shoots TURBOS in ncaa competition placed 17th at nationals, Dustin has also broken 400 three times last summer in 3d tournaments.
Sadly There is great resistance from a lot of archery dealers. We actually had some get angry at us at the ATA show . They were upset that we would hurt their fletching revenues.
I now have my product not just in Cabela's , but also in reputable archery distributors such as Jakes, Millers Outdoors, Ultra Products, F/S archery, The Archery Experts.
I know that a lot of archers including myself have been over hyped by all the new products and by the bow companies that try to make archery like the automobile industry and have something new every year.
It also saddens me when folks make judgments on hearsay.
Whether anyone uses my products or not should not be based on preconceived notions.
Some archers do not like them and some do. That is what makes the world go round.
For me to defend my product on this site I have to stand up for it.
If someone who is not involved in my business is free to put my product down , just because I make it , I think I should have the right to defend it.
I honestly believe it is an improvement in arrow flight .
The same controversies happend many years ago when Bear and Jenning got together and marketed the early compound bows.
My Dad would not sell them in our shop, we sold Wing, Black Widow, Hoytt all quality recurves.
My dad would also not make arrows for sight shooters, he thought they would ruin the sport.
My dad was wrong on these issues.
only time will filter out what benefits the sport of archery.
So far our products have been accepted my a good many archers who have found an improvement in their shooting using them.
The biggest problem we have had is getting new shooters to actually read the tuning instructions which are necessary to get optimum performance from the TURBO.
WE as men have an almost religious rule "DO NOT READ INSTRUCTIONS UNTIL BROKEN"
I apologize to those who feel I am advertising my product, but when I see unfounded negativity I must respond.
in several tournaments. If I remember correctly He placed very well in the Ill state Championships. He Shot at Vegas and shot a 298 first day which put us in 80th place, a 299 the second day and we moved up to 70 th place on the third day he shot a 300 and we finished up in 50th place out of a total of 4000 archers including probably 200 of the best in the world.
Not to shabby for prototype. He then went to Atlantic city and did not do well. This is the only pro to shoot my product. Dustin Yokum who shoots TURBOS in ncaa competition placed 17th at nationals, Dustin has also broken 400 three times last summer in 3d tournaments.
Sadly There is great resistance from a lot of archery dealers. We actually had some get angry at us at the ATA show . They were upset that we would hurt their fletching revenues.
I now have my product not just in Cabela's , but also in reputable archery distributors such as Jakes, Millers Outdoors, Ultra Products, F/S archery, The Archery Experts.
I know that a lot of archers including myself have been over hyped by all the new products and by the bow companies that try to make archery like the automobile industry and have something new every year.
It also saddens me when folks make judgments on hearsay.
Whether anyone uses my products or not should not be based on preconceived notions.
Some archers do not like them and some do. That is what makes the world go round.
For me to defend my product on this site I have to stand up for it.
If someone who is not involved in my business is free to put my product down , just because I make it , I think I should have the right to defend it.
I honestly believe it is an improvement in arrow flight .
The same controversies happend many years ago when Bear and Jenning got together and marketed the early compound bows.
My Dad would not sell them in our shop, we sold Wing, Black Widow, Hoytt all quality recurves.
My dad would also not make arrows for sight shooters, he thought they would ruin the sport.
My dad was wrong on these issues.
only time will filter out what benefits the sport of archery.
So far our products have been accepted my a good many archers who have found an improvement in their shooting using them.
The biggest problem we have had is getting new shooters to actually read the tuning instructions which are necessary to get optimum performance from the TURBO.
WE as men have an almost religious rule "DO NOT READ INSTRUCTIONS UNTIL BROKEN"
I apologize to those who feel I am advertising my product, but when I see unfounded negativity I must respond.
08-10-2004, 06:32 PM
#17
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Dover, PA USA
Posts: 5,497
RE: Turbo Nock
Nick,
I welcome you to the site and see nothing wrong with your explanation of your products nor do I see it as an advertisement.....we always welcome manufacturer input and support here to help with questions and concerns.
As with anything different that performs a familiar function in a new way there will be people who sit on both sides of the fence.....whether that be Whisker Biscuit or Drop away rests or Mechanical broadheads Vs. Fixed style, change brings discussion and sometimes controversy.
I always admire someone taking a shot at building a better mousetrap. And that's from someone who just enjoys the simple beauty of feather fletched arrows.
Good luck to you.
I welcome you to the site and see nothing wrong with your explanation of your products nor do I see it as an advertisement.....we always welcome manufacturer input and support here to help with questions and concerns.
As with anything different that performs a familiar function in a new way there will be people who sit on both sides of the fence.....whether that be Whisker Biscuit or Drop away rests or Mechanical broadheads Vs. Fixed style, change brings discussion and sometimes controversy.
I always admire someone taking a shot at building a better mousetrap. And that's from someone who just enjoys the simple beauty of feather fletched arrows.
Good luck to you.
08-10-2004, 06:54 PM
#18
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Detroit
Posts: 858
RE: Turbo Nock
Hey Bob...the pics were from 20 yard and yes they were field points. I'll clarify as well....they aren't my groups.
I have tested them with broadheads if that was the question and have had varrying reults.
Larger heads don't fare so well. They'll do much better with the new compact style heads. I'll list the broadheads I've shot with Turbos and give my oninions on each...
Arrows and length varied from Carbon Express to PSE carbon force to Easton Excel to Blackhawk Vapor to Alums at 2315 for target.
Magnus Snuffer 125-don't bother trying this yourself unless you under 220fps. Too much steering woth the snuffer.
Wac'em's "Triton" 100 grain. Right next to field points out to 40 yards and than they hit just 1/2" low and 1/2" left. Not sure if it was the Bhead or the Turbo but that's beyond my limit when hunting so I didn't g any further.
Rocket "Ultimate Steel" 75 grain. Wow. No difference ot to 50 and that;s where I stopped as I was shaving shafts. They recomend lighter tips but I was hesitant...I picked these up on a whim and a gave them a shot (literally) and I think this is what I'll be hunting with this season.
Cabela's Mini Lazer Pro 100 grain. I had issues with these when I shot feathers. Could never get them to spin. They grouped btw 4-5" at 30 yards with 5" feathers and I had 10 of them left over from last year so I figured I'd shoot them with the Turbos just for giggles before I tossed them. Groups shrunk to inside 2" at 30. They still don't spin for crap and The ither heads spu fine on the same shaft...I think it's the heads but the Turbos still negated the "slop" with the spin.
Bob you and I got some about the same time last year I think. You DO have to make some changes to your setup to shoot them so if your not into changing your nock point or shoot a TM hunter your not going to like them. They also shoot better a little nock high. Once I adusted my nocking point...."X" and I haven't looked back.
They do have a place though...They probably benefit me and my particular hunting situation the least. Thee stand under 30 yards, thick cover. Where they really shine is ina crosswind and 20+ yards. Kansas and the prarrie states would be the perfect setting for these. They cut through a crosswind 100% better than a 5" feather and the hardest hellical.
They may be a little louder than a feather but...man I don't know. I think it's about the same just a different sound.
As for Nick's post...can't blame him can you? He was only trying to relay the idea of how and why they work.
I have tested them with broadheads if that was the question and have had varrying reults.
Larger heads don't fare so well. They'll do much better with the new compact style heads. I'll list the broadheads I've shot with Turbos and give my oninions on each...
Arrows and length varied from Carbon Express to PSE carbon force to Easton Excel to Blackhawk Vapor to Alums at 2315 for target.
Magnus Snuffer 125-don't bother trying this yourself unless you under 220fps. Too much steering woth the snuffer.
Wac'em's "Triton" 100 grain. Right next to field points out to 40 yards and than they hit just 1/2" low and 1/2" left. Not sure if it was the Bhead or the Turbo but that's beyond my limit when hunting so I didn't g any further.
Rocket "Ultimate Steel" 75 grain. Wow. No difference ot to 50 and that;s where I stopped as I was shaving shafts. They recomend lighter tips but I was hesitant...I picked these up on a whim and a gave them a shot (literally) and I think this is what I'll be hunting with this season.
Cabela's Mini Lazer Pro 100 grain. I had issues with these when I shot feathers. Could never get them to spin. They grouped btw 4-5" at 30 yards with 5" feathers and I had 10 of them left over from last year so I figured I'd shoot them with the Turbos just for giggles before I tossed them. Groups shrunk to inside 2" at 30. They still don't spin for crap and The ither heads spu fine on the same shaft...I think it's the heads but the Turbos still negated the "slop" with the spin.
Bob you and I got some about the same time last year I think. You DO have to make some changes to your setup to shoot them so if your not into changing your nock point or shoot a TM hunter your not going to like them. They also shoot better a little nock high. Once I adusted my nocking point...."X" and I haven't looked back.
They do have a place though...They probably benefit me and my particular hunting situation the least. Thee stand under 30 yards, thick cover. Where they really shine is ina crosswind and 20+ yards. Kansas and the prarrie states would be the perfect setting for these. They cut through a crosswind 100% better than a 5" feather and the hardest hellical.
They may be a little louder than a feather but...man I don't know. I think it's about the same just a different sound.
As for Nick's post...can't blame him can you? He was only trying to relay the idea of how and why they work.
08-11-2004, 06:48 AM
#19
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location:
Posts: 7,571
RE: Turbo Nock
Thanks trushot, good honest post there. I guess I come to this board to get away from most of dealers and advertisements to get good honest unbiased opinions from people like yourself.
I won't even subscribe to any magazine. 90% BS if you ask me.
From a post 2/12/2003:
BTW, I was using a GKF Premier Drop Away
I won't even subscribe to any magazine. 90% BS if you ask me.
[Bob you and I got some about the same time last year I think. You DO have to make some changes to your setup to shoot them so if your not into changing your nock point or shoot a TM hunter your not going to like them. They also shoot better a little nock high.
I tried the turbo nock earlier this year and did not like them much. When I tried to tune with them, I ended up with the nock about 5/8" above 90 degrees. This was unexecptable to me and I adjusted the tiller and got the nock back to about 3/8th over 90. But then, I wasn' t happy with my tiller and I was having a difficult time keeping the pins on target without fighting the bow. There were some other problems, that I had with them as well. I went back to my normal four vaned arrows and all was good again. Just my experience with them.
08-11-2004, 09:16 AM
#20
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 106
RE: Turbo Nock
Hi BOBCO
I grew up working in my dad's archery shop. I would pour over and devour any magazine with new archery developments. I used to love to read the editorials posted by staff writers.
When we went to our first ATA show Two years ago , most of the major Archery magazines approached us and basically all gave us the same pitch.
They would place an ad in their new products section and even write a "free editorial"
If we purchased a certain amount of advertising space>
This was quite upsetting to me for the knowledge that editorials were a commodity to be sold!!!
What value is an editorial that in effect has been paid for?? Would they make any negative comments? I doubt it!!!
Just as you have come to not rely on magazine info, I basically stay away from them also. I do advertise in a few trade magazines, but have concentrated my enegries in internet and word of mouth. We also promote our product on The Sportsman Channel where you can see game being taken with our product.
It is a big problem for archers, actually any consumer , to filter through the hype and find products that actually work.
The biggest problem with promoting a product so radical as ours is that it is easy to classify it with all the hyped junk that is out there.
In as much as you can classify what I am writing as an advertisement, If I can not explain what my product does when there are issues brought up on forums, Then the forums are no better than the magazines.and the quality of the information discussed here is lowered.
Since introducing our product two years ago we have had to overcome the same startup problem of any new product.
Our first problem was that the original nocks were made from polycarbonate , which was strong, but had a tendancy to break vanes on impact. We solved that problem this past spring when we retooled our molds to accept a new glass filled nylon. Tom Rowe , who is on the board of directors of the ATA, actually headed up this project at Specialty Plastics in St Petets MO.
Specialty Plastics makes a lot of quality products for the Archery Industry. Hoytt, True Glow , are just a few.
The second problem was and still is to get an understanding of how the TURBO NOCK works as compared to ALL OTHER systems of arrow stabilization.
The TURBO NOCK is the only system in the entire history of archery to use the principle of rifling to stabilize arrows. The twisted nock actually spins the arrow instantly when the bow is shot. EVERY other product, feathers, vanes, quick spin vanes, accu vanes, curley vanes, etc
uses only wind resistance. All of them leave the bow with no rotation and have to pass through the atmosphere some distance to get up rpms and truely stabilize the arrow. The TURBO NOCK
(we call it nock not vane) Uses the nock to spin the arrow . The vanes on the TURBO only have to keep the arrow spinning, not make it spin! This means the TURBO can do a better job of stabilizing the arrow with 80%less vane.
Most archers who have problems with them do so because they try to set them up with the knowledge they have for setting up fletched arrows. TURBOS have more in common with bullets and tune and fly like bullets not arrows.
They effectively increase the spine of a shaft because of the instant high rotation, and virtually eliminate any FOC issues. Three plastic vanes five inches long and a plastic nock weigh on average 46 grains. the HUNTER weighs 54 grains the DEADX 44grains and the HTX 37.
FOC is an issue for conventional fletched arrows because they are not spinning when they leave the bow and in that first few feet of flight any unbalance because of weight or flex due to weak spine is magnified down range and results in loss of accuracy.
The TURBO which spins instantly 10 times faster than any other arrow does 20yds down range, basically eliminates spine and FOC.
We are a "MOM and POP" business and of course I want to make a profit from the fruits of my labor. But the real reason I decided to start this business was "payback"
I Started shooting when I was three and grew up in the sport. I met Fred Bear when I was a kid and actually got to stand and shoot beside Howard Hill! I grew to love this sport and when this idea popped into my head , my wife and I decided to pursue it.
As a kid working in my dads archery shop, I used to experiment with arrows and I would tell him that I was going to make the best arrows in the world!! Forty years later The TURBO idea just happened. So in a way I am making good on my word to my dad.
This got kind of long winded and I hope this explains my position.
I will not place any more promotional material on this site, but will respond to comments and questions.
I grew up working in my dad's archery shop. I would pour over and devour any magazine with new archery developments. I used to love to read the editorials posted by staff writers.
When we went to our first ATA show Two years ago , most of the major Archery magazines approached us and basically all gave us the same pitch.
They would place an ad in their new products section and even write a "free editorial"
If we purchased a certain amount of advertising space>
This was quite upsetting to me for the knowledge that editorials were a commodity to be sold!!!
What value is an editorial that in effect has been paid for?? Would they make any negative comments? I doubt it!!!
Just as you have come to not rely on magazine info, I basically stay away from them also. I do advertise in a few trade magazines, but have concentrated my enegries in internet and word of mouth. We also promote our product on The Sportsman Channel where you can see game being taken with our product.
It is a big problem for archers, actually any consumer , to filter through the hype and find products that actually work.
The biggest problem with promoting a product so radical as ours is that it is easy to classify it with all the hyped junk that is out there.
In as much as you can classify what I am writing as an advertisement, If I can not explain what my product does when there are issues brought up on forums, Then the forums are no better than the magazines.and the quality of the information discussed here is lowered.
Since introducing our product two years ago we have had to overcome the same startup problem of any new product.
Our first problem was that the original nocks were made from polycarbonate , which was strong, but had a tendancy to break vanes on impact. We solved that problem this past spring when we retooled our molds to accept a new glass filled nylon. Tom Rowe , who is on the board of directors of the ATA, actually headed up this project at Specialty Plastics in St Petets MO.
Specialty Plastics makes a lot of quality products for the Archery Industry. Hoytt, True Glow , are just a few.
The second problem was and still is to get an understanding of how the TURBO NOCK works as compared to ALL OTHER systems of arrow stabilization.
The TURBO NOCK is the only system in the entire history of archery to use the principle of rifling to stabilize arrows. The twisted nock actually spins the arrow instantly when the bow is shot. EVERY other product, feathers, vanes, quick spin vanes, accu vanes, curley vanes, etc
uses only wind resistance. All of them leave the bow with no rotation and have to pass through the atmosphere some distance to get up rpms and truely stabilize the arrow. The TURBO NOCK
(we call it nock not vane) Uses the nock to spin the arrow . The vanes on the TURBO only have to keep the arrow spinning, not make it spin! This means the TURBO can do a better job of stabilizing the arrow with 80%less vane.
Most archers who have problems with them do so because they try to set them up with the knowledge they have for setting up fletched arrows. TURBOS have more in common with bullets and tune and fly like bullets not arrows.
They effectively increase the spine of a shaft because of the instant high rotation, and virtually eliminate any FOC issues. Three plastic vanes five inches long and a plastic nock weigh on average 46 grains. the HUNTER weighs 54 grains the DEADX 44grains and the HTX 37.
FOC is an issue for conventional fletched arrows because they are not spinning when they leave the bow and in that first few feet of flight any unbalance because of weight or flex due to weak spine is magnified down range and results in loss of accuracy.
The TURBO which spins instantly 10 times faster than any other arrow does 20yds down range, basically eliminates spine and FOC.
We are a "MOM and POP" business and of course I want to make a profit from the fruits of my labor. But the real reason I decided to start this business was "payback"
I Started shooting when I was three and grew up in the sport. I met Fred Bear when I was a kid and actually got to stand and shoot beside Howard Hill! I grew to love this sport and when this idea popped into my head , my wife and I decided to pursue it.
As a kid working in my dads archery shop, I used to experiment with arrows and I would tell him that I was going to make the best arrows in the world!! Forty years later The TURBO idea just happened. So in a way I am making good on my word to my dad.
This got kind of long winded and I hope this explains my position.
I will not place any more promotional material on this site, but will respond to comments and questions.