cayugad

Sabotloader was kind enough to send me a few of the Lehigh .451 caliber conical bullets to test in my White Model 97 Whitetail Hunter .451 caliber rifle. This rifle has a 1-20 twist. And only a 22 inch barrel. It sports a Bushnell 2-7x32mm scope.

The weather was brutal today. 86 degrees out. So I was concerned about heat. Also there was a strong left to right wind. But at least it felt good, and kept the biting flies and other bugs at bay.

Mike normally shoots his Lehigh with a LARGE powder charge of Triple Seven. So I decided to use Triple Seven 2f powder today. When I shot the Lehigh 220 grain Conicals made of Brass, I shot 110 grains of powder. When I shot the all lead Bull Shop Conical Bullets I cut the charge back to 80 grains for the benefit of my shoulder. I was setting the whole works off with a Winchester Magnum #11 cap. I did swab when shooting the Lehigh conical bullets but not when shooting the Bull Shop, so they got no cool down period between shots as well.



I started at 50 yards. I let the Lehigh go first. This is where my White is sighted in for according to my records. Shot #1 was at 3 on a squeaky clean barrel. Shots 2&3 the ones that touched were shot after swabbing and letting the rifle cool down a little. Pretty good group, as I do believe at that distance the Lehigh would have just kept stacking, I saw no reason to shoot more. So with the rifle dirty, I swabbed the barrel clean, let it cool down, and broke out the Bull Shops.

The Bull Shop conical is 488 grains at .451 diameter. They really pack a punch and normally in the past shoot very well at this distance. I shoot them with 80 grains of Triple Seven 2f according to my notes.



since I had a new box, I shot off 5 of them. The first was on the left, the highest. After that it just started laying them in as it always does at this distance. I could hear that big lead hitting the steel trap back at the 105 yard line. Had a real nice ring to it.

After that I swabbed the barrel clean with Simple Green I got out of the house. At first, I had forgot a cleaner and was using spit. I was amazed at how dirty 110 grains of Triple Seven 2f was. There was powder all over the place. I wonder if this short barrel just could not fully burn off that kind of charge. With the barrel clean, I moved the target back to 100 yards. Even the range meter gave me 2 readings of 100 yards.



I fired four Lehighs at this distance because I think I flinched on the first shot. It was one of them things, your squeezing the trigger and a big drop of sweat lands in your eye. Looking through the spotting scope, I could see it was close to the bull, but was not sure it belonged there. So the next three kind of proved it did. Very nice group there for 100 yards and me shooting. I was amazed that the bullets did not drop all that much. I was now kind of exited to see how the Bull Shops would do.

Without swabbing after the last Lehigh shot, I fired off the 488 grain lead slugs.



I was not sure how much a drop there would be. But 2-1/2 inches sounds about right for a rifle sighted in at 50 yards. Then to prove to myself and for the opportunity to sweat more and shoot.. I adjusted my point of aim over the bull to the red solid bar and tried to see if I could bust the bulls eye. I would think that's dead deer accurate at that distance, even with my Kentucky wind-age.

On the last shot at the center, I had exhausted all my straight line capper magnum caps. And wearing a T shirt and shooting these loads, I could feel it in my shoulder.. so I decided to stop for the day.

Over all, these Lehigh are good shooters. THEY LOAD HARD. Not so much that you can't load them, but the sound they make sliding over the rifling of the barrel makes me grit my teeth. I found with my roundball starter, I can pop them quickly under the muzzle. And then its a short shot to the powder charge.

The rifle behaved like all Whites do.. perfect.

flounder33

Nice shooting with both bullets Dave.
And now, the million dollar question, if you had to make a choice right now which one of them would you take hunting?

cayugad

With the ease of loading, the hard hitting, and the fact that where I hunt you have a 50 yard shot as a long shot.. the 488 grain all lead Bull Shop would be loaded. I know that when I put that in the right place, that animal will not go far if at all.

This is actually a great question. Because lets say I was out west, where Mike is. Or some of these Dakota men. And their shots are 200 plus yards at times. While the conical can make that shot, I think learning the lighter Lehigh would have a great advantage there.

What do others think? Conicals are great bullets. But so are some of these others on the market.

sabotloader

Dave

Thank you a ton for the reports...

As I told you loading them into a Knight or Remington is really an effort. It can be done but it is tight. I was hoping they might be a little looser in one of your Whites.

It certainly is a different feeling pushing one of them down than a lead conical, you do feel everything in the bore and because of it's hardness it sounds awfull.

I think your targets have also confirmed my findings on the accuracy of the bullet.

The other difference I was shooting a 209 primer, 26" barrel and T7-3f powder versus T7-2f.

Here is a picture of my first opportunity at shooting them...



Also I put up a ballistic sheet...



Again thanks...

cayugad

I wonder if that short barrel really could burn off 110 grains of powder? The scope and action were covered with a gray dust of powder.

sabotloader

I am not sure about 2f but I am shooting 3f in a 22" barrel (a 50) and it seems to burn just fine with a 270 grain bullet.

I will know more later this week - I hope to get out and get some velocities with the Lighning.

Just another thought if you were getting a grey residue - I would say that is the ash left after the burn. How much of the cap did you have left in the breech area after the shot.

Which generates another thought - I do not have to patch after shooting at all with a cap. I have loaded 12 shots one right after the other.

If you get a chance - maybe back down to 90 grains... See if any difference

cayugad

The rifle and the back pressure completely destroy the cap. You simply turn the rifle to the side and small pieces of cap fall out. Actually the breech floor also gets coated in a black soot like substance that I use a Q tip to remove.

I will say the swabbing was easy. No crud ring what so ever. I really think I could have just shot and shot. Next time I will try some 3f Triple Seven and see how that behaves. Also I noted when I cleaned the rifle, the breech plug turned right out. So I wonder how tight I really had it seated.

sabotloader

I guess that is exactly what I was looking for... With 110 grains here - I get the cap side split into two distinct pieces but still on the post or in the face of the hammer. So I guess I am wondering about the size of the flash hole in your BP. The BP I got in the rifle, the nipple post was peened from being hit by the hammer. Called Doc about it and as soon as I told him about my intermittant ignition said turn it and sand it or replace it... So I am shooting a new BP. Do you have any replacement plugs?

Oh! now that puts a different light on the picture... OK so now you have another good reason and run another test session...

OK Back to loading,... Once through the crown, and I can not do that with out several raps on the short starter... the bullet now in the barrel - guestimate the amount of pressure you are pushing with... Both hands on the rod and pushing very hard? Compare it to loading a sabot?

Sorry for all the questions but at some point I am hoping Dave is going to get back to these...

cayugad

I have other breech plugs for the rifle. And loading would be less then a tight sabot, but a lot more then loading a slip fit.

sabotloader

Great! loading... that is what I was hoping for - I think you have answered the question I needed.

What we are finding or I have found the 45 caliber rifles are a lot closer to have a common bore diameter than do the 50's. We might be able to amke one bullet that will serve 80-90% of the 45 bores on the market.

I will get some pictures of my breech area the next time I shoot for comparison.