sabotloader

Ya... i just think of the last 3 jugs of APP I had.... 1 APP 2f, a JS of and a JS -3f....

After shooting a bit from each, I used the rest of them in Terry's flower garden next to the house... didn't tell her though...

Muley Hunter

Sabot...........Interesting that it has sulfur. I actually like the smell of sulfur. That's why I love using real BP.

Bh 209 must have a very small amount, or i'd smell it.

Hell, I don't care if it has peanut butter in it. It works.

builder459

Muley, you can bet the farm that hodgdon has a Bh209 type BP sub in the works. it wouldn't
surprise me if it was in testing already. BH 209 is taking a to big bite out of it's sales. Ray

Muley Hunter

If Hodgdon can come out with an equal powder to BH, and make it more available at a cheaper price. I'd buy more.

I doubt the cheaper price though.

sabotloader

IIRMC Chris Hogdon, turned the formula for BH down several years ago, it was presented to IMR, but I believe his, as well as many others, phlysophical differences with using a smokeless propellent in a ML made him make the decision. That is when General Dynamics of Canada was offered the powder... Right now I can not even remember the original name that it was going to come out with but it was not Black Horn. Heck! IMR already has a very simular powder in production $21 per pound. It wil not meter correctly and is a true smokeless.

At some point if it cuts into Pyro-T7 market enough you would think that he would have to budge, but at the present time it is still a minor share of the market - but growing.

builder459

Competition will lower the price, that is a certainty. right now BH209 has none and people are making the switch in huge numbers on a daily basis.would love to be a fly on the wall in Hodgdon's corporate offices lol Ray

sqezer

I stoped at the local sporting goods store this morning and they had JSG SUPER POWDER for sale, $22.95 a jug. He can get all he wants.

Gm54-120

Considering Hodgdon/IMRs monopoly on so many powders including import rights and what they choose to import.... Im all for any other viable options that will ruffle their feathers. They have probably tried to use their influence to alter ML regulations in a few states and refuse to import powders that compete with their own powders. N120 for example competes VERY favorably with 4198. This lead to a huge shortage of this powder in the states. Its actually much better for several applications but they are one of the few VV powder importers. They pick and choose too much and we pay the premium because of their monopoly.

Westerns monopoly on a nitro based sub has lead to the huge price difference. Its certainly isn't because it costs that much more to manufacture. There are many extruded smokeless powders that are WAY cheaper per pound and safe in the Savage. It wouldn't take much R&D for one of them to be altered for safe use in a sub gun.

The answer is simple IMR refuses to use their resources to offer this option since it would impact the other sub sales. They own most of them already.

I doubt the new "Super" powder is nitro based but considering what i stated above its worth a try. If its even close to their claims (consistently) both companies might be a bit more motivated to rethink their marketing and pricing....its a big might but we don't have many options. IMR will likely buy out APP and kill it like they have done in the past if they fear it as a threat to sub sales.

Gm54-120

Did you get any?

We need another guinea pig or two.

Muley Hunter

I'm not sure I could walk into my local gun shop, and say "give me some Super Powder".