sabotloader

Ray i am unable to tell you which Barne(s) it was or has been. When reading the different posts I do not remember which bullet they claimed they were shooting. It really did not matter to me so I really never paid any attention. It certaily could be the bullet you are suggesting - I just do not know. If you do a search on this site or even MM you might find the references. I just hate to say it was one specific bullet without knowing. The only thing i remember is the reference to Barnes...

I have no doubt that the Barnes, actually any Barnes, performed very well in the extended range situation, by that time the velocity has dropped and it will do it's work. The only failures that I recall were close range failures to expand on thin skinned whitetail. The bullet is just traveling so fast at the short ranges it litterally does not have time to expand in soft tissue before it is out of the animal and on it's merry way. I would imagine if it contacts a major bone that would be a different story entirely.

I think you could PM Lee and ask him, if I remember correct he is one of the folks that have discussed this happening to him.

I can tell you one thing for sure - it was not me. I have not shot enough of them to know. There was an independent company that did a study on bullet expansion and concluded that the Nosler Partiton expanded at a wider range of velocities than any other 'premium bullet' and yet I can not even remeber that study it was so many years ago.

Big 6x6 on MM could tell you as he has a printed copy of the study if I remember correctly....

builder459

If i could get noslers, it would be what i would use. as your aware of they quit making the popular M/L bullets. the Barnes i mentioned will expand on short and long shots. here in california certain area's you can only use non lead bullets and the guys that M/L have complained about the spit fire MZ, the one with the small hollow point not expanding at close range and others that use the Barnes center fire bullets have complained also.. it's all good. Ray

Gm54-120

www.wideners.com has the 44-250gr, 45-260gr and the 45-300gr Partitions for under $25 a box of 50.

Yep still in stock
http://www.wideners.com/itemdetail.c...id=527&dir=278
http://www.wideners.com/itemdetail.c...id=528&dir=278
http://www.wideners.com/itemdetail.c...id=529&dir=278

builder459

The knight red hot is the Barnes M/L bullet people here in California in the non lead zone have had penciling problems with. which is due to it's very small hollow point.a barnes expander mz with it's gaping hollow point and the TEZ basically same bullet, flat base,poly tipped hollow point are devastating on any animal shot with them at any range.Ray

SuperKirby

Thanks for all the feedback guys. I've been looking around trying to find a decent reliable bullet that's also affordable. I was going to shoot Gold Dots but can't find them locally anywhere. As I said, I would prefer pointy, but I understand that's probably more of a mental thing. I just didn't understand why that general shape of bullet seems to have so many problems in muzzleloaders. I can understand why they would have the penciling problems more than handgun bullets. I don't get why they have the problems they do with the jacket seperating and why they have that problem so much more than handgun bullets do. Oh well. The search continues

OldFlick

I have shot many deer from 10 to 200 yards with both 45 & 50 cal barnes(tipped & hollow point) and would never shoot anything else. I shoot slugs & handgun ammo w/Barnes and never had a problem with expansion. I wish you luck in finding a better bullet. I hunt in Delaware and their muzzleloading rules are no jacketed ammo.

nchawkeye

My "opinion" is that a larger hollow point styled bullet will open up more readily at most muzzleloading velocities...I also believe that most folk's velocities out of an inline, shooting saboted bullets will run between 1600-1900fps...At these velocities many of us won't shoot past say, 150-200 yards...My personal limit is 150 yards...

Now, those using smokeless or higher powder charges may be running velocities over 2,000fps...They will need a different mindset as to what bullet to use...

Since we are handloading, much thought needs to go into what bullet to use and also what ranges shots usually occur...

As a side note...The guy that invented the Savage smokeless muzzleloader lives in Greensboro, right up the road from me...He shoots the Hornady 300gr XTP .451 and kills deer at ridiculous ranges when he goes down to eastern NC where he does his field testing...He thinks that bullet is an awsome bullet for whitetails...

SuperKirby

I have some Barnes I found on sale several years ago but I'm almost out of them and can't justify paying what they go for normally. Of the XTP's I've shot, I haven't been able to get the accuracy out of them I would like to. Perhaps they'll shoot better out of the Pro Hunter.

OldFlick

I do not like the price either but between the performance and they have been, by far, the most accurate and consistant of the many rounds I have tried.

builder459

Seems Speer can't keep up with demand for there bullets.you can't find the .250 gold dot/ deep curl anywhere? that's a excellent bullet.again it's not the shape, it's the construction that causes problems.if you can't find gold dot/ deep curls you want buy some Barnes Expander MZ bullets.and if you want pointy the TEZ.Ray