T/C Shockwave blues
01-19-2010, 08:02 AM
#23
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Southeastern Ohio
Posts: 390
this is why I use the 300 grain Speer Uni-cor .451 SP. It's a bonded bullet and at 100 yards you can put it through the same hole. Shot 8-10 whitetails one time each. All were dead with expansion and all exited except for one head on shot on one deer.
This bullet (250 gr) has my head spinning after two different results on three seperate shots. Early in the season, I shot two deer on stand, both at around 45 yrds. The first deer I hit behind the shoulder on a quartering away shot. I followed the minimal blood trail for over 100 yrds then it dried up. Never found the animal. I suspected the angle was too much and the bullet just pissed clean through the animal, following the contour of the body and never hitting any vitals. I'm partly to blame as I should have aimed more for the last rib. The bullet definately passed through the animal as I found the hole in the ground it made after it exited the animal (it was standing on a steep hill).
From the same stand the second shot was broadside this time but a hang-fire caused me to flinch and I'm almost certain, given the way the animal took off, that it was a gut shot. Again the bullet passed cleaned through (another hole in ground). No blood at all on this one. Another lost deer.
At the end of the season I shot a doe at 200+ yards and dropped her on the spot. The season ended on a good note but the earlier lost deer are haunting me.
I love the accuracy of the Shockwave but I'm questioning the terminal performance of this bullet at short ranges. Has anyone had good long distance accuracy with Barnes expanders or Nosler Partisions?
From the same stand the second shot was broadside this time but a hang-fire caused me to flinch and I'm almost certain, given the way the animal took off, that it was a gut shot. Again the bullet passed cleaned through (another hole in ground). No blood at all on this one. Another lost deer.
At the end of the season I shot a doe at 200+ yards and dropped her on the spot. The season ended on a good note but the earlier lost deer are haunting me.
I love the accuracy of the Shockwave but I'm questioning the terminal performance of this bullet at short ranges. Has anyone had good long distance accuracy with Barnes expanders or Nosler Partisions?
01-19-2010, 10:42 AM
#24
Fork Horn
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Waynesville, Missouri
Posts: 166
What I've experienced is if your staying under 100 yards dont use the 250SW. I use them when I am going out past 100 yards. I shot a buck last year at 90 yards and the exit hole was the same size as the entery. No internal damage, no red jelly. I've killed a couple does at 125 and 150, and had more expansion with the bullet, and bigger exit wounds.
I use barnes (295 grain) under 100 yards, I cant get them to group well after 125 yards. They are very messy, red jelly all over, nasty bullets.
I use barnes (295 grain) under 100 yards, I cant get them to group well after 125 yards. They are very messy, red jelly all over, nasty bullets.
01-19-2010, 10:56 AM
#25
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
deroche117
I always really hesitate getting into this discussion because there is no winner - no perfect bullet... but, I will say from most of the information that I have read the SST/SW bullet or any pointy bullet IMO - is a great bullet at the longer ranges 200 yards and up. Most shoot the pointy bullet to gain BC and flight characteristics - IMO in 200 yards what does an extra 20 points mean in 200 yards.
I also need to say right off the top if you had not guessed in the opening paragraph - I do not and have not used the SST/SW for hunting. I think the bullet needs to do more that punch a hole into or through an animal. I have shot them at paper and they are really accurate if best accuracy is your thing.
Again IMO - the pointy bullet enters and exits a thinned skinned deer way to fast to allow them to work at the highest level at close ranges. One of the problems is the velocity that we shoot them at. Great to have that velocity for longer range shots and again after the bullet has slowed down at those longer ranges the bullet does have a better terminal peformance. At close ranges I think the opposite is true...
I think KC's statement sums it up about as best as it can be....
I would also add if you are one of those that choose to shoot this bullet - great! - that is the best thing about this thing we all can make our own choices - except when the State makes rules that we have to follow...
I always really hesitate getting into this discussion because there is no winner - no perfect bullet... but, I will say from most of the information that I have read the SST/SW bullet or any pointy bullet IMO - is a great bullet at the longer ranges 200 yards and up. Most shoot the pointy bullet to gain BC and flight characteristics - IMO in 200 yards what does an extra 20 points mean in 200 yards.
I also need to say right off the top if you had not guessed in the opening paragraph - I do not and have not used the SST/SW for hunting. I think the bullet needs to do more that punch a hole into or through an animal. I have shot them at paper and they are really accurate if best accuracy is your thing.
Again IMO - the pointy bullet enters and exits a thinned skinned deer way to fast to allow them to work at the highest level at close ranges. One of the problems is the velocity that we shoot them at. Great to have that velocity for longer range shots and again after the bullet has slowed down at those longer ranges the bullet does have a better terminal peformance. At close ranges I think the opposite is true...
I think KC's statement sums it up about as best as it can be....
KCbuckeye22
What I've experienced is if your staying under 100 yards dont use the 250SW. I use them when I am going out past 100 yards. I shot a buck last year at 90 yards and the exit hole was the same size as the entery. No internal damage, no red jelly. I've killed a couple does at 125 and 150, and had more expansion with the bullet, and bigger exit wounds.
What I've experienced is if your staying under 100 yards dont use the 250SW. I use them when I am going out past 100 yards. I shot a buck last year at 90 yards and the exit hole was the same size as the entery. No internal damage, no red jelly. I've killed a couple does at 125 and 150, and had more expansion with the bullet, and bigger exit wounds.
Last edited by sabotloader; 01-19-2010 at 10:59 AM.
01-19-2010, 03:43 PM
#28
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location:
Posts: 1,408
01-19-2010, 04:28 PM
#29
Boone & Crockett
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Idaho
Posts: 11,703
spaniel
I think the copper shotgun slugs are these Remington's and they are just a type 50 cal barnes like bullets in a sabot in the shotgun shell...
http://www.remington.com/products/am...bot-slugs.aspx
Copper. Tight-fitting, 8 fingered sabot. Centerfire round precision. Nose expands to over 2X cal. dia.. 5 rounds/box, 20 boxes/case
The 12 gauge Core-Lokt Ultra sabot bullet is a .50 caliber, 385 grain HP semi-spitzer. The catalog MV is 1900 fps and the 100 yard velocity is 1648 fps. The ME is given as 3086 ft. lbs. and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 2325 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +1.8" at 50 yards, +2.4" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.
The 20 gauge sabot bullet weighs 260 grains. It also has a MV of 1900 fps, and its velocity at 100 yards is given as 1615 fps. The ME is 2084 ft. lbs., and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 1506 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +2.0" at 50 yards, +2.7" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.
I think the copper shotgun slugs are these Remington's and they are just a type 50 cal barnes like bullets in a sabot in the shotgun shell...
http://www.remington.com/products/am...bot-slugs.aspx
Copper. Tight-fitting, 8 fingered sabot. Centerfire round precision. Nose expands to over 2X cal. dia.. 5 rounds/box, 20 boxes/case
The 12 gauge Core-Lokt Ultra sabot bullet is a .50 caliber, 385 grain HP semi-spitzer. The catalog MV is 1900 fps and the 100 yard velocity is 1648 fps. The ME is given as 3086 ft. lbs. and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 2325 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +1.8" at 50 yards, +2.4" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.
The 20 gauge sabot bullet weighs 260 grains. It also has a MV of 1900 fps, and its velocity at 100 yards is given as 1615 fps. The ME is 2084 ft. lbs., and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 1506 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +2.0" at 50 yards, +2.7" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.
01-19-2010, 06:31 PM
#30
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location:
Posts: 1,408
spaniel
I think the copper shotgun slugs are these Remington's and they are just a type 50 cal barnes like bullets in a sabot in the shotgun shell...
http://www.remington.com/products/am...bot-slugs.aspx
Copper. Tight-fitting, 8 fingered sabot. Centerfire round precision. Nose expands to over 2X cal. dia.. 5 rounds/box, 20 boxes/case
The 12 gauge Core-Lokt Ultra sabot bullet is a .50 caliber, 385 grain HP semi-spitzer. The catalog MV is 1900 fps and the 100 yard velocity is 1648 fps. The ME is given as 3086 ft. lbs. and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 2325 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +1.8" at 50 yards, +2.4" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.
The 20 gauge sabot bullet weighs 260 grains. It also has a MV of 1900 fps, and its velocity at 100 yards is given as 1615 fps. The ME is 2084 ft. lbs., and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 1506 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +2.0" at 50 yards, +2.7" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.
I think the copper shotgun slugs are these Remington's and they are just a type 50 cal barnes like bullets in a sabot in the shotgun shell...
http://www.remington.com/products/am...bot-slugs.aspx
Copper. Tight-fitting, 8 fingered sabot. Centerfire round precision. Nose expands to over 2X cal. dia.. 5 rounds/box, 20 boxes/case
The 12 gauge Core-Lokt Ultra sabot bullet is a .50 caliber, 385 grain HP semi-spitzer. The catalog MV is 1900 fps and the 100 yard velocity is 1648 fps. The ME is given as 3086 ft. lbs. and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 2325 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +1.8" at 50 yards, +2.4" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.
The 20 gauge sabot bullet weighs 260 grains. It also has a MV of 1900 fps, and its velocity at 100 yards is given as 1615 fps. The ME is 2084 ft. lbs., and the remaining energy at 100 yards is 1506 ft. lbs. The trajectory of that load looks like this: +2.0" at 50 yards, +2.7" at 100 yards, and +/- 0" at 150 yards.
I question the whole "centerfire precision" thing. It's a Herculean feat to shoot shotgun groups approaching what the fine gentlemen on this forum regularly post with their MLers.
After several years of hunting ML only when I went back to slug guns for a spell I found the overkill nature of the results a bit much for me. That's all I was trying to get at.