Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
01-12-2009, 11:48 AM
#22
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location:
Posts: 3,246
RE: Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
ORIGINAL: SWThomas
Barnes doesn't make a 300g T-EZ. Do you mean 290g?
ORIGINAL: gleason.chapman
+1 on the Nosler, Barnes, Speer Gold Dot. I would shoot 300g to get pass thru and I would use a Barnes MZ 300g for < 150 shooting and if I had to shoot 200 I would use the new Barnes T-EZ 300g flat based bullet. The are expensive but do the job. The Noslers in 300g flat based HG are great also. I you shoot a heck of a lot, the go with the Speer Gold Dot 300g and use it with a Crushed Rib sabot. Best Wishes on your testing and selection.
Chap
+1 on the Nosler, Barnes, Speer Gold Dot. I would shoot 300g to get pass thru and I would use a Barnes MZ 300g for < 150 shooting and if I had to shoot 200 I would use the new Barnes T-EZ 300g flat based bullet. The are expensive but do the job. The Noslers in 300g flat based HG are great also. I you shoot a heck of a lot, the go with the Speer Gold Dot 300g and use it with a Crushed Rib sabot. Best Wishes on your testing and selection.
Chap
01-12-2009, 02:23 PM
#23
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA.
Posts: 5,195
RE: Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
with the muzz you shoot, i agree , i would not use powerbelt hollow point BUT in HAWKINS .50 CAL FLINTLOCK ,OPEN SIGHTS , SHOOTING CLOSE,UNDER 100 YARDS.
no other bullet shoots out of mine than a POWERBELT 295/348 HOLLOW POINT loaded down...
no kick, less smoke, less noise,easy to load at 5 degrees above,no lubes,VERY ACCURATE,opens up nicely on deer at LOW LOAD,like 80 grs of 2f geox.
more deer are missed with a heavy kicking muzz.
more deer are lost shooting IN-LINE at high speeds with a POWERBELT HOLLOW POINT BULLET.
no other bullet shoots out of mine than a POWERBELT 295/348 HOLLOW POINT loaded down...
no kick, less smoke, less noise,easy to load at 5 degrees above,no lubes,VERY ACCURATE,opens up nicely on deer at LOW LOAD,like 80 grs of 2f geox.
more deer are missed with a heavy kicking muzz.
more deer are lost shooting IN-LINE at high speeds with a POWERBELT HOLLOW POINT BULLET.
01-12-2009, 02:30 PM
#24
Giant Nontypical
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: PA.
Posts: 5,195
RE: Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
ORIGINAL: MountainDevil54
they penetrate just fine for me and a lot of others out there. 245-295gr use 80gr powder.
they penetrate just fine for me and a lot of others out there. 245-295gr use 80gr powder.
shoot a deer close with a pb at high speed and you will be sorry.
they should market those POWERBELTS for open sight flintlocks only at low charges.
there they are OUTSTANDING,i love the dang things.
i hate recoil and these bullets open at low speeds.
no need for flat shooting high speed if you are only shooting under 100 yards or less.
01-12-2009, 03:07 PM
#25
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
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Posts: 3,246
RE: Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
ORIGINAL: sproulman
you are right on but most want those IN-LINE ones to rocket at deer.
shoot a deer close with a pb at high speed and you will be sorry.
they should market those POWERBELTS for open sight flintlocks only at low charges.
there they are OUTSTANDING,i love the dang things.
i hate recoil and these bullets open at low speeds.
no need for flat shooting high speed if you are only shooting under 100 yards or less.
ORIGINAL: MountainDevil54
they penetrate just fine for me and a lot of others out there. 245-295gr use 80gr powder.
they penetrate just fine for me and a lot of others out there. 245-295gr use 80gr powder.
shoot a deer close with a pb at high speed and you will be sorry.
they should market those POWERBELTS for open sight flintlocks only at low charges.
there they are OUTSTANDING,i love the dang things.
i hate recoil and these bullets open at low speeds.
no need for flat shooting high speed if you are only shooting under 100 yards or less.
Chap
01-12-2009, 03:55 PM
#26
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location:
Posts: 3,246
RE: Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
ORIGINAL: vadeer
When it comes to black powder, I was shooting Powerbelt bullets. I use them in a CVA Optima Pro - .50 cal. The accuracy is spot on; however, I have been disappointed with the lack of pass through and penetration. Having lost two deer over the prior two seasons, (they ran of w/ no blood trail), I am at the point where I lost confidence in the bullet. Towards the end of the ML season this year, I was letting deer walk, even as close as 50 yards. Time for a change.
To the point, I would like some recommendations for a bullet with good penetration and consistent accuracy for this gun. So far, I have the following four recommendations: 1) Hornady 44cal 240gr HP/XTP bullet; 2) Hornady 45cal 240gr XTP/MAG bullet; 3) Thompson center 50cal mag express sabots 240gr XTP bullets; and 4) and the Thompson center 50cal mag express sabots 230gr XTP. I appreciate your thoughts and comments.
When it comes to black powder, I was shooting Powerbelt bullets. I use them in a CVA Optima Pro - .50 cal. The accuracy is spot on; however, I have been disappointed with the lack of pass through and penetration. Having lost two deer over the prior two seasons, (they ran of w/ no blood trail), I am at the point where I lost confidence in the bullet. Towards the end of the ML season this year, I was letting deer walk, even as close as 50 yards. Time for a change.
To the point, I would like some recommendations for a bullet with good penetration and consistent accuracy for this gun. So far, I have the following four recommendations: 1) Hornady 44cal 240gr HP/XTP bullet; 2) Hornady 45cal 240gr XTP/MAG bullet; 3) Thompson center 50cal mag express sabots 240gr XTP bullets; and 4) and the Thompson center 50cal mag express sabots 230gr XTP. I appreciate your thoughts and comments.
http://randywakeman.com/MuzzleloadingWithBarnes.htmon what Barnes work in what rifles.
This is an old artcile by Bryce Towsley:
http://www.barnesbullets.com/information/product-news/publication-mentions/breaking-out-of-the-mold/
but still relevant.
Finally nothing gives you more satisfaction than to do your own MLer penetration tests. The PowerBelt Kid of Butch Cassity and the Sundance Kid fame(Frontieer Gander, AKA, MountainDevil54), did that for the powerbelt and got us the magic 80g rule. For various bullets shot froma Savage, the Left Hand did a whole bunch of bullets, SST/SW, XTP, Barnes, XTP/Mag, but you can see wound Channel and fragmentation in the perma gel. You of course want "large wound channel" with little or no fragmentation, that is here:
http://dougva.proboards34.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=Savage&thre ad=3370
with a whole bunch of links titled "Ballistics Gel tests By the Left Hand".
Finally for whatever bullets you decide to test, go to Cabelas, Midway and Gambrills and read ALL the posts about each bullet, making certain that you understand why a person DISLIKED a particular bullet.
Look around at what experts shoot and why? Why does Shockey shoot Nosler? Why does Bryce Towsley shootBarnes?Why does SabotLoader like Nosler partition 260 for deer and 300g rifle bullets for elk?What depth do bullets need to penetrate to kill? Why? Is a6" of penetration enough? Why or why not? Does shoot thru matter? Why? Does putting the whole energy into the deer kill it fast than shooting thru? Does fragmentation matter? Why?
Whatwill be your most likely hunting situations? Long fields up to 200 yards or most likely < 100 yards. Am I hunting where Bang Flops is needed? Am I a good trailer? Read all the product literature on a particular bullet from the manufacturer from their public web site. Use google to find out if the bullet fragments or pencils thru without expansion.
Shoot some bullets into sand, wet newspapers, or bound phone books or newspapers. Do they fragment, expand well? Are they muchroomed out, totally wrapped around themselfvess. Why does wrapping around themselves matter? Why does Garret Bullets load a 45/70 bullet to 1500 fps with a Garrett Hammerhead for Cape Bullalo? Why is a MLer a LOT like the 45/70 in FPS, bullets, loads, terminal performance? What do the 45/70 crowd use for bullets? Why are some african PH and Alaskan Bear Guidesnow using Marlin Guide lGuns in 45/70 oaded with Garrett Hammerheads for dangerous game? Why is a 45/70 going slow better than a375 H&Hgoing fast? Why is "Big and Slow is the Way to Go" a motto of Sam Fadala, the author of the Hornady MLer Reloading Manaual. Why is Fast and small the motto of he marketingblitz of TC and Greg Ritz and most of the modern day inline manufacturers? Why was SW bullets remarketed under the TC name? Why does Greg shoot them, but he doesn't require Shockey to shootthem?
Chap
01-12-2009, 04:02 PM
#28
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location:
Posts: 3,246
RE: Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
ORIGINAL: MountainDevil54
hey theres a difference between randy wakeman and i.
I dont get paid to like an item
hey theres a difference between randy wakeman and i.
I dont get paid to like an item
01-12-2009, 04:06 PM
#29
Banned
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Boncarbo,Colorado
Posts: 9,186
RE: Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
make this one #4
A PATCHED ROUND BALL CAN AND WILL KILL AN ANIMAL WHEN THE SHOOTER CAN HIT WHAT HE AIMS FOR.
But then again, i used a round ball that i cast from powerbelt lead, maybe thats Why.
A PATCHED ROUND BALL CAN AND WILL KILL AN ANIMAL WHEN THE SHOOTER CAN HIT WHAT HE AIMS FOR.
But then again, i used a round ball that i cast from powerbelt lead, maybe thats Why.
01-12-2009, 09:02 PM
#30
Spike
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 57
RE: Moving away from Powerbelt bullets; Need recommendations
ORIGINAL: MountainDevil54
hey theres a difference between randy wakeman and i.
I dont get paid to like an item
hey theres a difference between randy wakeman and i.
I dont get paid to like an item
But I do hear the "inflection" in your voice, that others are paid toSAY theylike something, and you like somehthing and then try to get paid for liking it. Nothing wrong with that!
Of course you are accusing Randy of saying he likes something only because someone pays him to say it. Do you really want to go down that road?