Accuracy Problems
12-18-2007, 08:00 PM
#11
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: southwest Ohio
Posts: 1,047
RE: Accuracy Problems
I'd try a different powder, specifically - Black powder.
I learned years ago when sighting in a new rifle use Black Powder first to determine the accuracy potential, then switch to the substitutes to see if any of them are compatible with the gun.
Long story, but I almost got rid of a new gun because I first used the old Clean Shot powder in it. It shot terrible with every bullet style and load I tried and I cleaned it and stuck it back in the gun cabinet thinking I'd trade it off first chance I got. A few months later I was having accuracy problems with another rifle I knew was capable of great accuracy. It had shot well a time or two with the substitute powder, but suddenly just wouldn't shoot well anymore. I had some Goex in my range box and switched to it and the rifle started performing again! Then the light went on in my head and I remembered I had never tried real BP in the rifle I had set aside as junk. Dug it out, went to the range and shot 1" groups at 100 yards with it using Goex!!!!!!!!!
I've found that Pyrodex is usually as dependable as BP for accuracy, butmany ofsubs can be very erratic under some conditions. I've had rifle that shot really good groups one day with APP, then terrible groups a day or two later with the same load. I haven't used enough T-7 to have confidence in it yet, but so far it seemsto beconsistent and gives decent accuracy.
For now, my hunting load is either BP or Pyrodex in all my rifles. Perhaps someday I'll find a dependable substitute, but for now I'd rather spend an extra few minutes cleaning the rifle than take a chance on poor accuracy when I'm hunting.
I learned years ago when sighting in a new rifle use Black Powder first to determine the accuracy potential, then switch to the substitutes to see if any of them are compatible with the gun.
Long story, but I almost got rid of a new gun because I first used the old Clean Shot powder in it. It shot terrible with every bullet style and load I tried and I cleaned it and stuck it back in the gun cabinet thinking I'd trade it off first chance I got. A few months later I was having accuracy problems with another rifle I knew was capable of great accuracy. It had shot well a time or two with the substitute powder, but suddenly just wouldn't shoot well anymore. I had some Goex in my range box and switched to it and the rifle started performing again! Then the light went on in my head and I remembered I had never tried real BP in the rifle I had set aside as junk. Dug it out, went to the range and shot 1" groups at 100 yards with it using Goex!!!!!!!!!
I've found that Pyrodex is usually as dependable as BP for accuracy, butmany ofsubs can be very erratic under some conditions. I've had rifle that shot really good groups one day with APP, then terrible groups a day or two later with the same load. I haven't used enough T-7 to have confidence in it yet, but so far it seemsto beconsistent and gives decent accuracy.
For now, my hunting load is either BP or Pyrodex in all my rifles. Perhaps someday I'll find a dependable substitute, but for now I'd rather spend an extra few minutes cleaning the rifle than take a chance on poor accuracy when I'm hunting.
12-18-2007, 09:26 PM
#12
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 426
RE: Accuracy Problems
It was never mentioned how often you were cleaning or if you were cleaning between shots. I have the regular Optima not the Pro series and it prefers a spit patch between loads. I used to swab with the windex mixture but found it groups better with just a spit patch and then dry patch. As far as powder, it really likes 777 FFg. Good luck and have fun.
12-18-2007, 09:52 PM
#13
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: New Mexico
Posts: 1,081
RE: Accuracy Problems
"I measure my powder with a test tube type measurer and tap on it until the powder goes down to 80 grains."
If I understand what you are saying you are using a tube that is marked in grains but not adjustable, then tapping it until it settles to 80 grains. I think that would be a rather inconsistant way of measuring powder. You need to spend $5 or $10 and get a real powder measure that is adjustablewith the swivel funnel top. I bought several over the last few years at Walmart during their end of season closeouts for around $3 or $4 each.
I have so far not had good luck with APP/JSG powder. It averages about 300fps slower than 777 of the same volumn. My son's Optima works very well with Pyrodex P and a 250 Shockwave (80 to 100 grains of powder). We always swab with a spit patch between shots for best consistancy.
Another thing to consider, try a heavier Powerbelt i.e. 348. Some guns prefer a heavier bullet for best accuracy. Also you may get better pressure from your JSG with the heavier bullet and thus get the bullet to "bump up" into the rifling more consistantly for better accuracy. Using more powder may help the 295's for the same reason.
Good luck with it.
If I understand what you are saying you are using a tube that is marked in grains but not adjustable, then tapping it until it settles to 80 grains. I think that would be a rather inconsistant way of measuring powder. You need to spend $5 or $10 and get a real powder measure that is adjustablewith the swivel funnel top. I bought several over the last few years at Walmart during their end of season closeouts for around $3 or $4 each.
I have so far not had good luck with APP/JSG powder. It averages about 300fps slower than 777 of the same volumn. My son's Optima works very well with Pyrodex P and a 250 Shockwave (80 to 100 grains of powder). We always swab with a spit patch between shots for best consistancy.
Another thing to consider, try a heavier Powerbelt i.e. 348. Some guns prefer a heavier bullet for best accuracy. Also you may get better pressure from your JSG with the heavier bullet and thus get the bullet to "bump up" into the rifling more consistantly for better accuracy. Using more powder may help the 295's for the same reason.
Good luck with it.
12-19-2007, 02:41 PM
#14
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location:
Posts: 14
RE: Accuracy Problems
Thanks for all the help. I'm heading out to do some shooting now. Gonna play some more with the JSG just to keep from throwing it away. I would rather burn it a little at a time. Then Im going to try some other powders and see what happens. The good thing is I enjoy the heck out of shooting, and experimenting. In fact I like it alot more than my wife or my pocket book allows.
12-19-2007, 03:10 PM
#15
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: central NY
Posts: 127
RE: Accuracy Problems
Consider changing your ignition source if you are using 209 primers. There is a lot of good data being generated that shows that 209 primers are just too powerful and are the source of inconsistant accuracy. Go to prbullet.com and read what they have to say about switching to one of the small rifle primer ignition systems. The small rifle primer and Pyrodex loose powder combination is the most consistant system I have found. I also got away from Powerbelts for poor bullet performance. I found they were a very soft bullet and were flattening out on impact rather than mushrooming. I did not feel I was getting the penetration with them that I should.
