KP1 is here
12-08-2007, 11:03 AM
#13
Typical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 666
RE: KP1 is here
Well, I got to say, that safety, well that safety just looks, well it just looks GAY dangit. I thought those KP1's was a falling block but I see they is just another hinge gun, lord don't we have enough hinge guns already??
12-08-2007, 01:45 PM
#14
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,092
RE: KP1 is here
Shuddup Smurf. 
After that Idaho conversion do-hickey?? 
EDITED THE PICTURE OF THE SAFETY POSITIONS - I had them wrong in the first picture due to reversing the wording!! Safety lever to the rear is the FIRE position. Sorry bout that.
After that Idaho conversion do-hickey?? EDITED THE PICTURE OF THE SAFETY POSITIONS - I had them wrong in the first picture due to reversing the wording!! Safety lever to the rear is the FIRE position. Sorry bout that.
12-08-2007, 03:51 PM
#15
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,092
RE: KP1 is here
keep clicking if you want to go completely mad. And scoped
I'm going to have to do something about those bases - need a bit more extension up front. Will try to get it boresighted and to the range at first good opportunity. Thanks for your patience and perserverance.
A link to the full review thus far is http://www.sunrisearchery.com/KNIGHT_KP1.htm I will add a shooting report as soon as I'm able to do so.
12-08-2007, 10:45 PM
#16
Nontypical Buck
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Staunton,Va
Posts: 3,713
RE: KP1 is here
looks better in your photos then in the flier that I have for it. I can't wait till you get it out and shoot it, to see the report.
I really gotta stop reading this new gun threads.
oops was that all out load. [8D]
I really gotta stop reading this new gun threads.
oops was that all out load. [8D]
12-17-2007, 07:23 PM
#17
Nontypical Buck
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,092
RE: KP1 is here
Fired the KP1 today. Weather - mostly clear, gusty winds, temperature at beginning was 44ยบ and felt to be slowly dropping as the shooting progressed (wind chill probably). The weatherman said winds at 5-10 MPH but it was more like 5-20 MPH and was in a quartering left to right direction.
A bit cold for my hands and my eyes kept watering due to the wind. I think that had more impact on my shooting than the wind itself. So much for my excuses.
I started by shooting UC Shorts at ~25 yards. Triggers are something I'm never able to judge as well during dry firing as during actual shooting from the bench. My first shots revealed, in addition to the take up noted earlier, just a wee bit of give before reaching the breaking point. I fired a total of 8 shots at 25 before getting the impact where I wanted - far more than normal. This was for a couple of reasons: the Leupold scope was nearly max'd out on height adjustment (only a tiny bit left before the stop), some dummy moved the windage the wrong direction once
, and I had to up my powder charge from 70 to 80 grains to get the impact even that small amount into the adjustment range of the scope.
It would seem the mount bases need to be shimmed to gain a more centered scope adjustment. This is a common problem with Encores and it appears that Knight has followed the same path. Perhaps Knight and/or other base makers will compensate with bases that already have a bit of offset built in. I would suggest they do so. I don't like to shoot with a scope's adjustments so near the stops and I'm sure the scope manufacturers don't recommend that practice.
Components used
The Swiss and W209s were used throughout. I was shooting the rifle with the standard 209 plug in place. I double-damp swabbed with MAP dampened patches between bullet changes and single damp swabbed between each shot. Damp swabbing was followed by a dry patch each time. Before switching to sabots, I swabbed the bore with 6 damp patches and followed with two dry.
After finally getting the impact to touch the top of the bull at 25 yards, I moved my target box out to the 100 yard backstop. There I continued to shoot the UC Shorts for group using a charge of 80 grains of Swiss with an overpowder wad. I don't know if it was the temperature or what, but for some reason my bubblegum lube was not behaving well. Not only did it leave too much excess at the muzzle after loading, it left a ring in the bore after firing (about where the loaded bullet had been).
The UC Shorts were a wee bit more difficult to load than I would prefer and I believe that is one reason my shooting results were not too impressive with either those or Bat's NEWs (those were also just a little hard to start but did not leave as much lube residue either at the muzzle or in the bore). I did lower the charge while shooting Bat's heavier bullets to 70 grains.
Next up came Bull Shop Dan's 610 grain gas-checked big boys. By my mic' those bullets are just a tiny bit over .503 and the difference was notable, particularly after the gas check made it into the muzzle. I stuck with the 70 grain charge (NO overpowder wad) and was anticipating more recoil than I experienced. And they shot very well.
To me, the above group says it all as to whether the rifle will shoot conicals decently. The answer is a definite yes. I believe the two other conicals tried would have also performed better if they had been sized to .503". The KP1 stock distributes recoil to the shooter in a much less harsh manner than does an Encore. With the load above, an Encore with a synthetic stock would likely have left me crying like a little girl. I was very pleased with that aspect of the rifle's performance.
It was during the shooting of those big boys that I noticed the action start to accumulate blow-back residue inside. At this point I had fired 17 rounds with real black powder and was about to switch to sabots. And my hands were at the "almost numb" stage.
Set the TC U-view powder measure up to 90 grains volume and left it there for all the sabot rounds. 300 grain XTPs in black MMP sabots were first up. A quick refresher as to why I don't like sabots came with seating that first one. They were quite difficult to get down the bore and I believe seating pressure may have had significant effect so far as the vertical stringing these four shots exhibited.
Followed the 300 grainers with 4X 200 grain 10mm XTP in blue MMP 50/40 sabots and then 3X 200 grain 10mm Shockwaves. I fired the fourth XPTas I thought something didn't seem right about that odd 3rd one that cut the bull. The fourth XTP went back to the first two. The Shockwaves didn't do well at all - perhaps the wind had more effect at the time they were shot. I don't know and by that point, caring was a bit difficult.
There was no blow-back at all escaping the action in the upward direction - the scope remained as clean at the end as the beginning. Primers did not stick and were easily removed with cold fingers. I didn't take along my straight Ted Cash 209 capper and didn't miss it much, though it would likely have made installing the 209s a bit easier.
But to summarize cleaning in a short phrase... it's a bear!!
The deposits you see in the above pictures are certainly the worst areas, but residue made it down into the action and to the rear of the underlug. I found cleaning to be very time consuming and involved a lot of toothbrush action. I had wondered (after about the first 12 shots today)whether there was going to be any blow-back into the action at all, but continued shooting provided quite a bit of the nasty stuff. The area inside the barrel around the breech plug is a large pain to clean out. I may have to get a baby bottle brush to have one big enough to scrub that area. As it was, it took quite some doing.
But after a hot, soapy water soak with toothbrush scrubbing, followed by multiple trips to the air compressor, a spray down of all metal with WD-40 and then more trips to the compressor, I managed to get things reasonably clean. The individual parts are now leaned against the wall draining into paper towels. Some time this evening I will put everything back together and put it in the rack upside down.
I've installed the FPJ breech plug and extractor in the bore and believe the next outing will be using the jackets to see if that cuts back on the amount of residue. One thing that would be a great improvement (it seems to me, would be to have a piece that fills most of the void around those breech plugs. That open area is just waiting for debris and residue.
Some improvements to be made and problems to address, maybe Knight will take notice.
A bit cold for my hands and my eyes kept watering due to the wind. I think that had more impact on my shooting than the wind itself. So much for my excuses.
I started by shooting UC Shorts at ~25 yards. Triggers are something I'm never able to judge as well during dry firing as during actual shooting from the bench. My first shots revealed, in addition to the take up noted earlier, just a wee bit of give before reaching the breaking point. I fired a total of 8 shots at 25 before getting the impact where I wanted - far more than normal. This was for a couple of reasons: the Leupold scope was nearly max'd out on height adjustment (only a tiny bit left before the stop), some dummy moved the windage the wrong direction once
, and I had to up my powder charge from 70 to 80 grains to get the impact even that small amount into the adjustment range of the scope. It would seem the mount bases need to be shimmed to gain a more centered scope adjustment. This is a common problem with Encores and it appears that Knight has followed the same path. Perhaps Knight and/or other base makers will compensate with bases that already have a bit of offset built in. I would suggest they do so. I don't like to shoot with a scope's adjustments so near the stops and I'm sure the scope manufacturers don't recommend that practice.
Components used
The Swiss and W209s were used throughout. I was shooting the rifle with the standard 209 plug in place. I double-damp swabbed with MAP dampened patches between bullet changes and single damp swabbed between each shot. Damp swabbing was followed by a dry patch each time. Before switching to sabots, I swabbed the bore with 6 damp patches and followed with two dry.
After finally getting the impact to touch the top of the bull at 25 yards, I moved my target box out to the 100 yard backstop. There I continued to shoot the UC Shorts for group using a charge of 80 grains of Swiss with an overpowder wad. I don't know if it was the temperature or what, but for some reason my bubblegum lube was not behaving well. Not only did it leave too much excess at the muzzle after loading, it left a ring in the bore after firing (about where the loaded bullet had been).
The UC Shorts were a wee bit more difficult to load than I would prefer and I believe that is one reason my shooting results were not too impressive with either those or Bat's NEWs (those were also just a little hard to start but did not leave as much lube residue either at the muzzle or in the bore). I did lower the charge while shooting Bat's heavier bullets to 70 grains.
Next up came Bull Shop Dan's 610 grain gas-checked big boys. By my mic' those bullets are just a tiny bit over .503 and the difference was notable, particularly after the gas check made it into the muzzle. I stuck with the 70 grain charge (NO overpowder wad) and was anticipating more recoil than I experienced. And they shot very well.
To me, the above group says it all as to whether the rifle will shoot conicals decently. The answer is a definite yes. I believe the two other conicals tried would have also performed better if they had been sized to .503". The KP1 stock distributes recoil to the shooter in a much less harsh manner than does an Encore. With the load above, an Encore with a synthetic stock would likely have left me crying like a little girl.
I was very pleased with that aspect of the rifle's performance. It was during the shooting of those big boys that I noticed the action start to accumulate blow-back residue inside. At this point I had fired 17 rounds with real black powder and was about to switch to sabots. And my hands were at the "almost numb" stage.
Set the TC U-view powder measure up to 90 grains volume and left it there for all the sabot rounds. 300 grain XTPs in black MMP sabots were first up. A quick refresher as to why I don't like sabots came with seating that first one. They were quite difficult to get down the bore and I believe seating pressure may have had significant effect so far as the vertical stringing these four shots exhibited.
Followed the 300 grainers with 4X 200 grain 10mm XTP in blue MMP 50/40 sabots and then 3X 200 grain 10mm Shockwaves. I fired the fourth XPTas I thought something didn't seem right about that odd 3rd one that cut the bull. The fourth XTP went back to the first two. The Shockwaves didn't do well at all - perhaps the wind had more effect at the time they were shot. I don't know and by that point, caring was a bit difficult.
There was no blow-back at all escaping the action in the upward direction - the scope remained as clean at the end as the beginning. Primers did not stick and were easily removed with cold fingers. I didn't take along my straight Ted Cash 209 capper and didn't miss it much, though it would likely have made installing the 209s a bit easier.
But to summarize cleaning in a short phrase... it's a bear!!
The deposits you see in the above pictures are certainly the worst areas, but residue made it down into the action and to the rear of the underlug. I found cleaning to be very time consuming and involved a lot of toothbrush action. I had wondered (after about the first 12 shots today)whether there was going to be any blow-back into the action at all, but continued shooting provided quite a bit of the nasty stuff. The area inside the barrel around the breech plug is a large pain to clean out. I may have to get a baby bottle brush to have one big enough to scrub that area. As it was, it took quite some doing.
But after a hot, soapy water soak with toothbrush scrubbing, followed by multiple trips to the air compressor, a spray down of all metal with WD-40 and then more trips to the compressor, I managed to get things reasonably clean. The individual parts are now leaned against the wall draining into paper towels. Some time this evening I will put everything back together and put it in the rack upside down.
I've installed the FPJ breech plug and extractor in the bore and believe the next outing will be using the jackets to see if that cuts back on the amount of residue. One thing that would be a great improvement (it seems to me, would be to have a piece that fills most of the void around those breech plugs. That open area is just waiting for debris and residue.
Some improvements to be made and problems to address, maybe Knight will take notice.
12-17-2007, 07:33 PM
#18
Dominant Buck
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 21,193
RE: KP1 is here
Underclocked.. do you think this might be a rifle that likes sabots over conicals? Or do you feel you have not played enough with conicals? It looks like it was doing pretty good with the 200 grain XTP's especially since you mentioned it was a windy day...
