Mark whiz

Jim,

I believe you'll find that the extra 2" of barrel might not make your gun more accurate as a whole, just a maybe little more accurate at longer distances - plus it should add about another 100 to 150fps to a given load. It might help recoil a little as well, but I think that depends more on weight than it does length - a shorter-barreled, yet heavier gun may well do better on recoil than a lighter, longer-barreled model.

You mentioned smokeless powder in #5 - the model made by Savage is the ONLY muzzleloader equipped to handle smokeless. While the use of smokeless sounds like the "Holy Grail" for muzzleloaders, most people I've seen post about it get frustrated with smokeless load work-up and end up shooting Pyro or 777 out of the guns.

That Firebolt will probably be a good choice and I would also suggest a Knight Wolverine - it will come in under the $300 mark and leave room for a nice scope. I shoot a Knight USAK, which is their baseline model (about $180) and almost identical to the Wolverine except for the trigger assembly & ignition system. I have been well pleased with it for the past couple of years as it will (with the right load) cut holes all day long at 100yds - and with a 22" barrel at that. I wouldn't hesitate to shoot out to 150yds with it.

Oh, one more thing, if you hunt in Indiana - do NOT get a .45cal model. State law says that the smallest bullet you can shoot is either a .44 or .45 cal (not including the sabot) - that means that your bullet choice for deer is limited to either PowerBelt bullets or lead conical bullets. As picky as m'loaders can be with bullets & loads, the odds are against you finding your most accurate load under those constraints.


"Every moving thing that liveth, I give unto you as meat" (Gen 9:3)

Trust God..........but keep your powder dry!

Deleted User

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JagDog

Thanks Dan and to all of you. I held the Omega50 and fell in love with it. That is going to be my choice. Camo with the SS barrel. I will post a new ? about a scope. I will also post when I make my purchase.

Mark whiz

That Omega's a good choice - if I was in the market for another in-line it would probably be my choice too.


"Every moving thing that liveth, I give unto you as meat" (Gen 9:3)

Trust God..........but keep your powder dry!

3bigbucks

They do make a gun that shoots acurate at 200 yards. Its caLLED A THOMPSON CENTER ENCORE. mINE SHOOTS VERY CONSISTENTLY AT 200 YARDS. i CAN PUT SHOTS IN A 2 INCH DIAMETER AT 200 YARDS. My dad shot a deer last year at 234 yards. @40 grain bullet and 150 grains of powder. But this gun is kinda pricy i got about 800 in mine with scope and all.

herman

3Big Bucks,how about trading Encores with me?You can check out the targets as to how mine shoots 100 yds but mine won't shoot consistently 2 in groups at 200 yds,I haven't even got a 2in group at 200 yds yet.
I would like to try some of those 40 gr bullets your dad uses too.
A buddie took 2 bucks this year at 274 yds and 270yds but they were with a savage shooting smokless.

http://www.hunting-pictures.com/memb...ght&encore.jpg

eldeguello

Any number of muzzleloaders will shoot tight groups at 200 yards. Also, a round-ball rifle can be as accurate as any other kind. However, the round ball loses velocity so fast that it has a very steep trajectory beyond 50 yards or so. Additionaly, the RB is greatly effected by crosswinds, so shooring at distances much beyond 100 yards is very chancy if any wind is blowing at all! Consequently, if you want to shoot at longer ranges, you will have to use a bullet with much higher ballistic coefficient than a round ball has. This means using a barrel with a much faster twist, to stabilize the long bullets. Such barrels cannot be used accurately with round balls, except with very light charges. Otherwise, the balls strip, and accuracy is lost. You will need at least two guns (or interchangeable barrels) if you are going to shoot long, pointed bullets and round balls both.

Keep yore powder dry!!

1SHOT_1KILL

JagDog,

Form what you are describing, it sounds like you want a Savage 10ML-II.

1. $300? Maybe on a used one. Add about $50-75 and you can get a new one in blued with synthetic stock. Stainless about $400-450.

2. Tight grouping? Definately, if you do your home work and learns what it takes to make the 10ML-II shoot. At 200yds, the 10ML-II is very capable of delivering 3" groups and 2,200-2,500 FPE. The mainly problem with any M/L accuracy at longer ranges, is bullet design more so than, the inherent accuracy of the rifle. Most M/L's today are designed to shoot saboted bullets (1:32" or 1:28" twist), but the bullets themselves are more often designed for pistols. These bullets are short and stubby, have flat noses, hollow points, and a very low BC. At longer ranges many things, like wind, up or down thermal drafts, the loss of velocity, etc., have more of an adverse affect on the bullet, making that 2" 200yd group, the very rare exception rather than the rule. Then again, at 200yds you have got to have FPE to put the game down cleanly. Someone listed the 1,100 PFE minimum, at point of impact rule. The 10ML-II can deliver that kind of FPE out to 300yds. The 10ML-II is the only legitemate 200+ M/L on the market, when loaded with smokeless powder. With BP or any other BP substitute, it will produce the exact same performance as any Knight, T/C, etc.

3. Easy cleaning? The easiest cleaning M/L on the market. Takes less than 5 mimutes.

4. Least reoil? Depends on the load combination or the level of performance wanted. A 250gr bullet at 2,000 FPS in like shooting a .243 Win, but jack it up to the 2,600+ FPS range and it is like shooting a .300 Win Mag.

5. Versital? The 10ML-II is the most verital M/L there is. It can be shot with BP, Pyrodex, 777, or any other substitute on the market. But it is the ONLY ONE that smokeless powder can be shoot in. With the 1:24" twist, round balls more than likely will not shoot well at all, but saboted bullets will, and with the right loads lead conicals will shoot acceptable as well.


If you would like to get more information on the Savage 10ML-II, check ou this link:
http://www.dream-tools.com/tools/mes...gemuzzleloader
You can get all the answers to any questions that you may have concerning the Savage 10ML-II.

Edited by - 1SHOT_1KILL on 01/16/2003 12:21:06

Edited by - 1SHOT_1KILL on 01/16/2003 12:25:22

round ball

Sounds to me like you want a 270 cal not a muzzle loader 200 yrs is not in the realm of front loading guns sorry

Underclocked

Ssssh, don't tell my White that 200 yards isn't its realm. It doesn't know that.