Educate me here.....
#11
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Depends on the season
Posts: 326
RE: Educate me here.....
ORIGINAL: Alsatian
younggun 243: I recall you have posted asking about elk hunting before. A couple of suggestions. First, buy a book on elk hunting and read it: most such books will talk about the elk permit systems. One decent book is the Jim Zumbo Elk Hunting book in the Complete Hunter book series, though there are other good elk hunting books. Second, order the Big Game regulations of several of the Western states and read them very carefully -- Colorado, Idaho, Wyoming, New Mexico, Utah, Arizona. There just isn't a short cut for doing some time consuming due diligence research on this topic. Third, get the Colorado Big Game CD and use it to get more knowledge about seasons, draw probabilities, and success rates. Get to work bud!
I'm not an expert, but most of the attractive elk permits from my perspective are limited draw permits. You have to study the particular game management units versus seasons versus public/private land relationships to understand this issue clearly. Some of the elk seasons combine elk and deer seasons and this leads to more hunters in the field; these combined seasons may be later in the year when snow up high in public lands is more probable, both making these lands difficult to hunt and pushing the elk to lower, private lands. Study the regulations and then ask experienced elk hunters focused questions.
younggun 243: I recall you have posted asking about elk hunting before. A couple of suggestions. First, buy a book on elk hunting and read it: most such books will talk about the elk permit systems. One decent book is the Jim Zumbo Elk Hunting book in the Complete Hunter book series, though there are other good elk hunting books. Second, order the Big Game regulations of several of the Western states and read them very carefully -- Colorado, Idaho, Wyoming, New Mexico, Utah, Arizona. There just isn't a short cut for doing some time consuming due diligence research on this topic. Third, get the Colorado Big Game CD and use it to get more knowledge about seasons, draw probabilities, and success rates. Get to work bud!
I'm not an expert, but most of the attractive elk permits from my perspective are limited draw permits. You have to study the particular game management units versus seasons versus public/private land relationships to understand this issue clearly. Some of the elk seasons combine elk and deer seasons and this leads to more hunters in the field; these combined seasons may be later in the year when snow up high in public lands is more probable, both making these lands difficult to hunt and pushing the elk to lower, private lands. Study the regulations and then ask experienced elk hunters focused questions.
The guy is trying to do the legwork and learn about the regulations, that is why he is posting questions here. After all, isn't that what these forums are for? I think he asked a very simple and pointed question that could be answered without the purchase of books, software and regulation guides. I don't mean to call you out, but in general,I see these types of responses in theBig Game Hunting forums. A lot of, "people won't help you here until you prove you are worthy". I think that is the wrong approach for people getting into the sport. I for one need all the help I can get and I consider these forums an invaluableresearch tool. Just my 2 cents.
#12
Typical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Denver, Colorado
Posts: 599
RE: Educate me here.....
I think Alsatin is reasonably wellon beam.
Some folks ask, and ask, and ask, and ask.... to the point that you'd have to write a book to answer it all, henceseeing some evidence of study, investment, and exercise of grey matterbefore being willing to contribute more to the"give it to me" approachis reasonably fair. This is especially applicable in those instances where it appears that someonemay just bedreaming about "someday isle",in which case"investment and study" are a really adecent route for them to go IMO as it gets them closer to actuality.
Jumping in and learning some of this stuff first hand and spending modest sums of money for materials and information will make it "stick" way better than constantly "being told" on the freebee quick and easy internet. Alsatin suggests nothing that I personally didn't do to figure things out (back in the day).
Some folks ask, and ask, and ask, and ask.... to the point that you'd have to write a book to answer it all, henceseeing some evidence of study, investment, and exercise of grey matterbefore being willing to contribute more to the"give it to me" approachis reasonably fair. This is especially applicable in those instances where it appears that someonemay just bedreaming about "someday isle",in which case"investment and study" are a really adecent route for them to go IMO as it gets them closer to actuality.
Jumping in and learning some of this stuff first hand and spending modest sums of money for materials and information will make it "stick" way better than constantly "being told" on the freebee quick and easy internet. Alsatin suggests nothing that I personally didn't do to figure things out (back in the day).
#14
Typical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Denver, Colorado
Posts: 599
RE: Educate me here.....
"....I guess my point is, if you don't want to answer a question, then I don't think a response is necessary...."
(2)"The Question"ended up NOT beingA question, rather it was a string of questions proliferating faster than any one could fully answer with no real indication of comprehension of the earlier answers given before more questions were launched. At that point, IMHO Alsatin gave some pretty good advice.... "since you need a book size answer.... go get a book" (paraphrase),and he offered somebook recommendations....
#15
RE: Educate me here.....
You are on the right track. Contact the Game and Fish and DNR's of several states. I hate to see a young hunter whom is enthused about an elk hunt given a hard time because he doesn't know it all like some. I am not very familiar with regulations in most other states but if I was, I would be happy to pass it on. Good luck and read those books.
#16
RE: Educate me here.....
ORIGINAL: younggun308
Nah, I ain't going to be doing a DIY for awhile, since my uncle isn't in the position to do that, but I do want to know in advance how the situation works, since I am interested, I sure hope that bull elk tags go back to OTC for sure, since that would make it easier to hunt elk later.
I heard there's more elk than deer in Colorado, but I bet Mule Deer would be nice.
Just out of curiosity, is Colorado easier to draw than Idaho, and if so, how many years do you have to wait to draw for Deer?
Thanks for the info, that does give me a little grip on things.
I have one more question, what about bear? Is that draw?
Nah, I ain't going to be doing a DIY for awhile, since my uncle isn't in the position to do that, but I do want to know in advance how the situation works, since I am interested, I sure hope that bull elk tags go back to OTC for sure, since that would make it easier to hunt elk later.
I heard there's more elk than deer in Colorado, but I bet Mule Deer would be nice.
Just out of curiosity, is Colorado easier to draw than Idaho, and if so, how many years do you have to wait to draw for Deer?
Thanks for the info, that does give me a little grip on things.
I have one more question, what about bear? Is that draw?
#17
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Depends on the season
Posts: 326
RE: Educate me here.....
(2)"The Question"ended up NOT beingA question, rather it was a string of questions proliferating faster than any one could fully answer with no real indication of comprehension of the earlier answers given before more questions were launched. At that point, IMHO Alsatin gave some pretty good advice.... "since you need a book size answer.... go get a book" (paraphrase),and he offered somebook recommendations....
isn't Colorado OTC, with the exception of Sheep, Goats?Or is itdraw tags? Why am I hearing about draw tags? Are only a few areas OTC?
Are there any other states that have OTC areas for non-residents?
How does the system work? I heard something about Idaho and Montana having preference points, and when you apply every year, you gain more and more pointsif you don't draw, and some partial refund, and if you do draw, it's prepaid, I guess? And then you just go up there and hunt?
There is not one of those questions that required him to run out and buy a book to answer. What level of question do you feel is ok to be answered outright? Like it or not, the internet,including hunting.net is replacing print media.
#18
Typical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Denver, Colorado
Posts: 599
RE: Educate me here.....
I recall you have posted asking about elk hunting before. A couple of suggestions. First, buy a book on elk hunting and read it: most such books will talk about the elk permit systems. One decent book is the Jim Zumbo Elk Hunting book in the Complete Hunter book series, though there are other good elk hunting books.
Second, order the Big Game regulations of several of the Western states and read them very carefully -- Colorado, Idaho, Wyoming, New Mexico, Utah, Arizona. There just isn't a short cut for doing some time consuming due diligence research on this topic.
Third, get the Colorado Big Game CD and use it to get more knowledge about seasons, draw probabilities, and success rates. Get to work bud!
This isnot simplestuff; quickie, "wing it" simplisticanswers are oflittle or no value without the detail behind it as to why.... and therein lies the need for the books, the regulation pamphlets from multiple states, and the CD (optional).
Feel free to do arobust job of answering that string of multi-state questions yourself.
We'll watch.
#19
Fork Horn
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Depends on the season
Posts: 326
RE: Educate me here.....
This addresses the pattern endless questions regarding general elk hunting fromthreads previous to this one.
Second, order the Big Game regulations of several of the Western states and read them very carefully -- Colorado, Idaho, Wyoming, New Mexico, Utah, Arizona. There just isn't a short cut for doing some time consuming due diligence research on this topic.
This is the same reference materials that someoneanswering his questions robustly would have to turn to in order to answer the "multi-state" questions, so he may as well read it forhimself.
Third, get the Colorado Big Game CD and use it to get more knowledge about seasons, draw probabilities, and success rates. Get to work bud!
Optional, extra credit.
This isnot simplestuff; quickie, "wing it" simplisticanswers are oflittle or no value without the detail behind it as to why.... and therein lies the need for the books, the regulation pamphlets from multiple states, and the CD (optional).
This isnot simplestuff; quickie, "wing it" simplisticanswers are oflittle or no value without the detail behind it as to why.... and therein lies the need for the books, the regulation pamphlets from multiple states, and the CD (optional).
Feel free to do arobust job of answering that string of multi-state questions yourself.
We'll watch.
We'll watch.
#20
Typical Buck
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Denver, Colorado
Posts: 599
RE: Educate me here.....
".... Do YOU research every posters history before you decide to respond?"
Some folks make helping them out very rewarding.... you can tell they grasp it by their responses, you can tell they are sharpening what they have learned by incisive followup responses, they give feedback after their trip/season as to how it worked and what they learned....
Other folks, ".... ah, not so much."
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Hence myapproval for Alsatin's response.